introducing players to GT - recommendations?

[GlassJaw]

I'm getting close to starting a GT campaign and I want to introduce my players to the ruleset and style of play before the actual campaign starts. The group has pretty much only played "standard" D&D campaigns but I want to introduce some different styles of play. This will also be sort of a litmous test to see if they like and therefore will go out and buy the book.

I was thinking about running a generic one-shot or some sample encounters with some pre-made characters to show them what some characters look like and also how GT differs from D&D. I also want the intro to be diverse so they can get a feel for what they can do within the system but generic enough so I don't have to get into any specifics of my actual campaign world (I don't want to do that until the campaign actually starts). The setting will basically be a low-magic mix of Conan meets Dune meets Cthulhu.

So, does anyone have any recommendations about how to go about this? What types of characters should I make? What level? What types of encounters are good to showcase the various classes?

 

[Rodrigo Istalindir]

First of all, decide now what variants you want to use in your real campaign (eg 'Fewer Dead Heroes'). Some of these are very different than what your players are used to.

If you are going to let them make their own characters for the real campaign, let them go through the process once for the one-off. This is an area that is totally alien to those that have only been exposed to D&Ds class system. I'd suggest letting them make 4th level characters or so. That will let them experiment with how multiclassing works, and gives them a couple feats and talents to play with. Plus, they won't die as quickly.

For an adventure, maybe an X-Files type thing. That would let you bring in vehicle and firearm rules, as well as the new fear mechanics that will be pretty prevalent in a Cthulu influenced campaign.

Magic is the trickiest part. In a really low magic GT campaign, magic will be more like a supernatural class ability than the spellslinging they're used to, especially if they don't burn a bunch of talents on spellcasting. You'll also need to decide ahead of time what spells they will have access to and when. Perhaps give all of the characters some small 'psychic' power (detect evil, cure minor wounds, mage hand) and consider it a sort of psionic 'A' Team. This will get them used to spellcasting DCs and spell burn without them running the risk of killing themselves.

Damn, I've got to find a GT game to play in. This game is really starting to get a hold on me. Next thing you know I'll starting worshiping Nightfall and calling myself the self-appointed evangelist for Grim Tales

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

Damn, I've got to find a GT game to play in. This game is really starting to get a hold on me. Next thing you know I'll starting worshiping Nightfall and calling myself the self-appointed evangelist for Grim Tales

I'd love to have an evangelist!

 

[GlassJaw]

First of all, decide now what variants you want to use in your real campaign (eg 'Fewer Dead Heroes'). Some of these are very different than what your players are used to.

Done. I'll probably write up a sheet with all the variants.

If you are going to let them make their own characters for the real campaign, let them go through the process once for the one-off

Well I was thinking of giving them some basic pre-gens so that can see what the system can do and what their options are. Going from standard D&D to generic classes is quite different. I've already had one guy ask me what if someone wants to play a caster. My response was something like "well, it doesn't really work that way...." I'd rather give them a character with a couple of spells so they can see how it works.

That would let you bring in vehicle and firearm rules

Well other than horses and wagons, there won't be any other vehicles and firearms so I won't have to worry about that.

the new fear mechanics that will be pretty prevalent in a Cthulu influenced campaign.

Yeah, I definitely want to use those.

Magic is the trickiest part. In a really low magic GT campaign, magic will be more like a supernatural class ability than the spellslinging they're used to, especially if they don't burn a bunch of talents on spellcasting

True. I'll probably make one character with a couple of spells just to give them a taste.

Damn, I've got to find a GT game to play in. This game is really starting to get a hold on me

Bigtime. It's the exact thing I needed after getting kind of burned out on D&D. I really want to get my players going and start running a campaign.

I'd love to have an evangelist!

Hmm, I've been speaking on the virtues of GT a lot lately too.

 

[Fenris]

I'd love to have an evangelist!

Me first, me first!

Do you swear to play Grim Tales, the whole Grim Tales and nothing but Grim Tales, so help you Wulf.

I do.

fenris

 

[Rodrigo Istalindir]

Hey, I was here first.

I tuned the scenario the way I did to expose the players to the greatest variety of rules. Plus, you did want something different than your proposed campaign -- guns and cars ought to throw them off the scent!

I'd still recommend letting everyone dabble with magic. It is so different than stock D&D that those who want to play casters will need to experience it, and the rest should get a taste of what their caster(s) will be facing in the regular campaign.

Things that will blow their minds:

* Spells don't automatically succeed, and at low levels, will probably only succeed half the time
* To approach D&D level spellcasting, a character will have to devote nearly all of his talent choices to Improved Spellcaster. This reduces a lot of the appeal of GT in terms of character flexibility.
* Little to no magic healing -- Healing HPs the natural way is slow, and those used to getting bashed about and being ready to go the next day (or the next hour) will have to adjust their tactics. This is a big issue for casters, who take ability score damage that heals very slowly.
* Massive Damage Threshold -- In Old One's game, we nearly lost a 7th level character in the first round of combat to a single hit during an AoO. Players used to the charge first, ask questions later tactic will be quite surprised. As a DM, you'll need to be careful with foes that do high levels of damage with a single blow, as they are much more deadly in GT. Combined with the slow healing, this puts a much greater emphasis on not getting hit than D&D.

 

[Old One]

Things to spend time on...

GJ -

A couple of thoughts...

(1) Spend some time on critical success, critical failure, crit confirms, fumble inflicts and other things (certain feats and talents) that require action point (AP) activation or awards. This mechanic changes the flow of the game to a certain extent, for both players and GMs and deserves a bit of extra time. As a GM, decide how many "skulls" you are going to use in awarding APs on natural 1s. If you are like me...it will be frequent. I would also suggest giving fewer APs for the one-shot. Players start w/ 5+1/2 level, rounded down...but a one-shot encourages full expenditure, whereas in an on-going campaign, they are likely to shepard them a bit more. Maybe a flat 5 APs to start.

(2) As Rodrigo suggested, decide which variants you want in play. The Campaign Design Sheet (or whatever it is called) in the back of the book can be helpful to get you started. I think alot of it really depends on how Grim you want it...you could either ease them into it with all the 1-skull options or give 'em system shock with all 3-skull options.

(3) Horses and wagons? What about the chariot chase through slippery cobble-stoned streets during a major festival in the pouring rain - que John Wu music - that is what I am talkin' about!

(4) Lock down a list of craft, knowledge and profession skills before starting. This will need to be genre/setting specific. One thing I wish GT had included was a chart of archaic/modern/apocalyptic craft, knowledge and profession skills (cross-referenced with appropriate synergy bonuses). Of course, the GM could do this...but I am lazy !

(5) If you are going to allow crafting of magic items...read, then re-read the item creation feats. Pay particular attention to creation time, XP costs (and XP savers) and component costs.

(6) I might provide 1 or 2 PCs that have NOT taken magical adept with a spell or two...just to see what they do with it ! At a critical juncture, will that Smart Hero try and tempt fate?

~ Old One

 

[Old One]

.
* Massive Damage Threshold -- In Old One's game, we nearly lost a 7th level character in the first round of combat to a single hit during an AoO. Players used to the charge first, ask questions later tactic will be quite surprised. As a DM, you'll need to be careful with foes that do high levels of damage with a single blow, as they are much more deadly in GT. Combined with the slow healing, this puts a much greater emphasis on not getting hit than D&D.

Wahoo...everything RI said is gospel...especially this one !

Even with the most forgiving MDT (CON + Armor Bonus + Natural Armor Bonus + Shield Bonus), an activated crit against a PC or a big, high-damage monster can be very deadly (as they should be). You might want to spend a bit of extra time explaining that. Of course, on the flip side, as the GM, you have complete control over whether or not a crit is activated against a PC...so it does take some of the randomness out of it.

~ Old One

 

[Rodrigo Istalindir]

Even with the most forgiving MDT (CON + Armor Bonus + Natural Armor Bonus + Shield Bonus), an activated crit against a PC or a big, high-damage monster can be very deadly (as they should be). You might want to spend a bit of extra time explaining that. Of course, on the flip side, as the GM, you have complete control over whether or not a crit is activated against a PC...so it does take some of the randomness out of it.

~ Old One

Heh..a single power-attacking giant could be a TPK waiting to happen.

If it were me, I'd try to keep players averaging around 2 or 3 action points. More than that and it starts skewing thing too much. Less than that and they're apt not to have one at a critical moment (no pun intended). Of course, if they insist on spending them frivolously, let them suffer the consequences.