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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Magus Coeruleus" data-source="post: 1143392" data-attributes="member: 1704">This is still hairy.  What happens if an Improved Invisible creature threatens, attacks, flanks, yadda yadda yadda, and then for a round stops threatening (sheathes weapons or whatever).  Is the defender automatically aware of this?  If not, and if he fails to realize this, is he still "flanked" since he assumes the invisible guy is still threatening, or is he no longer flanked because he isn't actually threatened.  For that matter, what if the invisible creature quietly manages to slip away?  Is there the possibility that the defender will continue to suffer as if flanked because he does not yet realize that the invisible guy bailed?These situations reinforce, for me, the value of requiring that for someone to flank, they must make their threat (in a technical sense, as in threaten) clear.  There is room for this since even though 3E is not 2E with its 1-minute rounds, there still is the assumption that in 6 seconds' time there is darting about, a few feints and parries (in fact, part of what iterative attacks represents is more of those things turning into "real" attacks).  IMO, the way an invisible creature manages to flank is that it basically "advertises" it's threat.  The defender may hear the swipes, smell the creature, see subtle distortions in the air, feel vibrations and the air swooshing and glancing feints, etc.  Whatever flavor descriptions you like.  I assume that if you are flanking, you are doing these things to keep the defender on his toes so that he has to divide his attention or what have you.  Thus, if you no longer threaten, or leave, as an invisible character, the defender will quickly pick up on the fact that he is no longer flanked.Similarly, imagine someone is waiting in a hidden niche (not invisible, but hiding in shadows or something), ready to strike someone who comes within 5'.  I'd say the ambusher here threatens even if he keeps totally still and quiet, waiting for his quarry to enter a threatened square.  But let's say a clearly visible ally is in a position to flank with the ambusher.  If the hapless prey winds up between them and would otherwise not detect the ambusher, I'd say that if the ambusher wants to provide flanking status, he needs to make his threat clear enough that the prey knows that he is being flanked.  Again, that doesn't mean he automatically knows anything else about the ambusher, such as specific location, just that he's flanked, but he can infer quite a bit.  This is entirely relevant because the visible ally might just have initiative over the ambusher, so the ambusher needs to either help and reveal something, or stay tight but not provide a flanking bonus to his pal..02</blockquote>

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