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<blockquote data-quote="Rel" data-source="post: 377871" data-attributes="member: 99">This has been a very interesting thread all the way around.For now, I still think that forced movement should cause AoO's, which I agree could get a bit messy at times.&nbsp; But I would argue that not having AoO's for forced movement could cause some equally wonky situations.For example:An Ogre manages to charge the party Wizard and the Wizard is now in a very tough spot.&nbsp; He can't afford to escape because doing so would cause an AoO due to movement.&nbsp; He can't afford to cast a spell because doing so would also cause an AoO and any single attack by the Ogre could kill him.No problem.&nbsp; The Fighter in the party can just Bull Rush the Wizard out of the Ogre's threatened area.&nbsp; Sure the Ogre gets an AoO on the Fighter (just one though unless the Ogre has Combat Reflexes) but the Fighter probably has better AC and Hit Points than the Wizard and can take the hit a lot easier.&nbsp; Even if the DM doesn't allow the Wizard to &quot;Take 0&quot; on his opposed Strength check, the Fighter will outclass him on Strength by a big margin anyway.If the Wizard is smart enough to Delay his action until the Fighter completes his Bull Rush, he can then move away and cast a spell that might end the Ogre threat for good.In such a case, I can only imagine the poor Ogre looking at the camera and saying, &quot;Bull Rush?&nbsp; More like Bull****!&quot;Of course the DM can always overrule this situation, but I don't like to do that.&nbsp; That's what rules are for.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Rel, post: 377871, member: 99"] This has been a very interesting thread all the way around. For now, I still think that forced movement should cause AoO's, which I agree could get a bit messy at times. But I would argue that not having AoO's for forced movement could cause some equally wonky situations. For example: An Ogre manages to charge the party Wizard and the Wizard is now in a very tough spot. He can't afford to escape because doing so would cause an AoO due to movement. He can't afford to cast a spell because doing so would also cause an AoO and any single attack by the Ogre could kill him. No problem. The Fighter in the party can just Bull Rush the Wizard out of the Ogre's threatened area. Sure the Ogre gets an AoO on the Fighter (just one though unless the Ogre has Combat Reflexes) but the Fighter probably has better AC and Hit Points than the Wizard and can take the hit a lot easier. Even if the DM doesn't allow the Wizard to "Take 0" on his opposed Strength check, the Fighter will outclass him on Strength by a big margin anyway. If the Wizard is smart enough to Delay his action until the Fighter completes his Bull Rush, he can then move away and cast a spell that might end the Ogre threat for good. In such a case, I can only imagine the poor Ogre looking at the camera and saying, "Bull Rush? More like Bull****!" Of course the DM can always overrule this situation, but I don't like to do that. That's what rules are for. [/QUOTE]

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