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<blockquote data-quote="Wulf Ratbane" data-source="post: 2288061" data-attributes="member: 94">That's not entirely fair.If Iron Lore heroes are better equipped to defeat the gorgon in the first place (and in my case I'd revert to something like higher saves/Action Points/Fate Points) then there's no need to worry about being turned to stone.'Turned to stone' is, essentially, 'dead.' Given that characters can die in other ways through perfectly mundane avenues of 'failure' (the loss of hit points being the most obvious) then this makes a certain kind of sense.Note that the gorgon, despite it's &quot;save or die&quot; ability, is still just CR8. This means that it's balanced as a moderate encounter against PCs who do not yet have access to Raise Dead, let alone Stone to Flesh.What this essentially says is that the &quot;difficulty&quot; of overcoming the combat aftermath (ie, whether or not somebody got turned to stone) is not really factored into the gorgon's CR. It's assumed that the PCs, through whatever resources they have, are not going to fall to the gorgon in the first place.This is important: CR does not concern itself with the aftermath. It is used ONLY as a guide to the likelihood that the PCs can overcome a single encounter.Can four 8th level D&amp;D fighters tackle a gorgon? Well, the rules say yes (and I tend to agree).So four Iron Heroes (whose magic weapons and cloaks of resistance are built into their basic advancement profiles) should have about the same difficulty.Though it is easy to leap to Mike's defense here, I am still concerned about a few other critters (and their relative Iron Heroes CR).Wulf</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Wulf Ratbane, post: 2288061, member: 94"] That's not entirely fair. If Iron Lore heroes are better equipped to defeat the gorgon in the first place (and in my case I'd revert to something like higher saves/Action Points/Fate Points) then there's no need to worry about being turned to stone. 'Turned to stone' is, essentially, 'dead.' Given that characters can die in other ways through perfectly mundane avenues of 'failure' (the loss of hit points being the most obvious) then this makes a certain kind of sense. Note that the gorgon, despite it's "save or die" ability, is still just CR8. This means that it's balanced as a moderate encounter against PCs who do not yet have access to [i]Raise Dead[/i], let alone [i]Stone to Flesh[/i]. What this essentially says is that the "difficulty" of overcoming the combat aftermath (ie, whether or not somebody got turned to stone) is not really factored into the gorgon's CR. It's assumed that the PCs, through whatever resources they have, are not going to fall to the gorgon in the first place. This is important: CR does not concern itself with the aftermath. It is used ONLY as a guide to the likelihood that the PCs can overcome a single encounter. Can four 8th level D&D fighters tackle a gorgon? Well, the rules say yes (and I tend to agree). So four Iron Heroes (whose magic weapons and cloaks of resistance are built into their basic advancement profiles) should have about the same difficulty. Though it is easy to leap to Mike's defense here, I am still concerned about a few other critters (and their relative Iron Heroes CR). Wulf [/QUOTE]

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