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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 6242782" data-attributes="member: 87792">That isn't how I remember 2002-2004 era Char-op on the WotC char-op boards (which is when I was active).  It was well known that the most powerful thing you could have was 9th level spells - and nothing was worth a drop in caster level.  On the other hand, contrary to reputation, CharOp wasn't just about the most power you could produce (Barbarian 1/Bard 4/Ur-Priest 4/Nar Demonbinder 1/Mystic Theurge 10 with a caster level IIRC somewhere in the 40s in the days before before Pun-Pun).  The challenge was more normally to hit certain benchmarks (BAB 16, 9th level spells, various others).  And Fighter 1 (or occasionally Fighter 2) gives all martial weapons, all armour, and a feat.  An extremely flexible package for qualifying for one of dozens of useful prestige classes.  Also the advice on fighter isn't IMO as you remember it.  It was "Fighter 1 is often useful and very flexible.  Fighter 2 is sometimes useful.  Under no circumstances ever take Fighter 3.  It is useless, pointless and something that you simply should not do because it is so weak".3.0 ranger, likewise.  The advice was "If you want to play a two weapon fighter of some sort, a single level of ranger is an extremely good bargain.  Do not under any circumstances take a second level in ranger or you will get laughed at.  But a single level in ranger is worthwhile for a two weapon combatant".And I don't know about you - but to me the advice "Take the first level in this class if you want to do this but under no circumstance take the second level in the class" doesn't say to me that the class is overpowered.  It says that the class is front-loaded. [MENTION=22424]delericho[/MENTION] also has a point - that CharOp standard have improved and casters have become more flexible.  But at least in 2002 the fighter and the ranger were not seen as strong classes, merely classes that could be of use putting builds together if and only if you took one level in them (possibly two for the fighter but never more).</blockquote>

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