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Message: <blockquote data-quote="SenseiMike" data-source="post: 4479789" data-attributes="member: 77571">Frankly, it's never enough.  This thread is about if 4E does it for me, and I outlined why it doesn't, helping to defend the OP against the horde of irrational 4E fans who seem to want to pass over our points as though they're trivial, and resort to hyperbole and sarcasm as though that ends the debate.  I have to deal with this sort of thing every time I visit with my local GM Club and some of them want me to run a 4E game again, which I won't.  I've heard every argument for 4E and the premise of it, but they don't wash.   If you think 4E is great, fine.  I disagree completely, and I won't play it or run it or support it anymore with material to Dungeon, nor will my colleagues.  Maybe, in five or ten years when they come out with 5E, they'll fix it to where it's a role-playing game again.  But until then...</blockquote>