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<blockquote data-quote="Reynard" data-source="post: 3820678" data-attributes="member: 467">You are being disingenuous.&nbsp; Chain swords and light sabers are not legacy elements that have always existed as a part of the game...... and SoD are, having helped to define certain groups' playstyles by the effect they have on adventures and encounters.But the design goals of 4E don't seem to include keeping older players or bringing them back, as 3E's design goals did.&nbsp; SoD is just another legacy element that is happily getting excised, like Vancian casting, in favor of... what, exactly?&nbsp; While I am certain that some 3rd part publisher will reintroduce SoD spells, monsters and the like (I am looking at you, Necromancer) within days of 4E's release, that is not the point: the point is that it has always been a part of the game and the motivation for removing it isn't to make the game better or increase everyone's fun, it is to make a certain kind of game better and increase the fun of a particular kind of D&amp;D player/DM.&nbsp; it is limiting and restrictive and suggests that the designers know not just what makes a better mechanic, but what makes a better adventure, better milieu and better game (in the at the table sense) than the player/DM.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Reynard, post: 3820678, member: 467"] You are being disingenuous. Chain swords and light sabers are not legacy elements that have always existed as a part of the game... ... and SoD are, having helped to define certain groups' playstyles by the effect they have on adventures and encounters. But the design goals of 4E don't seem to include keeping older players or bringing them back, as 3E's design goals did. SoD is just another legacy element that is happily getting excised, like Vancian casting, in favor of... what, exactly? While I am certain that some 3rd part publisher will reintroduce SoD spells, monsters and the like (I am looking at you, Necromancer) within days of 4E's release, that is not the point: the point is that it has always been a part of the game and the motivation for removing it isn't to make the game better or increase everyone's fun, it is to make a certain kind of game better and increase the fun of a particular kind of D&D player/DM. it is limiting and restrictive and suggests that the designers know not just what makes a better mechanic, but what makes a better adventure, better milieu and better game (in the at the table sense) than the player/DM. [/QUOTE]

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