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<blockquote data-quote="GreyLord" data-source="post: 8555026" data-attributes="member: 4348">9th level (for Fighters and Warriors at least, 10th for Rogues/Thieves, 11th for Wizards/Mages, and also 9th for Clerics/Priests unless you were a druid and then it was 12th, 8th for Monks and Barbarians) was seen as the end game in AD&amp;D for many.The rules had an implied change about them where the PC has reached the Zenith and become the Lord of the manor.&nbsp; It switches from being the adventurer to the rulers of the land, and as such, many would then transition to being retired or NPC's in the campaign for many.It was a different &quot;ending point&quot; than many games that came after.&nbsp; Various editions of D&amp;D have tried different tiers of gaming where different ideas apply.&nbsp; Even 5th edition does this.&nbsp; The only edition that really didn't do it or imply it as much was 3.X, and even then, they did &quot;Epic Levels&quot; for those who wanted to...though in theory you could use other advancement schemed past 20th level (for example, my favorite was the Swords and Sorcery version in the Advanced Players Guide) and even had 2 different versions to choose from (the one in the Epic Level Handbook and the simpler found in the FRCS).4th edition had it divided into 3 tiers...sort of copying the idea that you transition from Adventurers and Heroes to Leaders of the Land (Heroic to Paragon Tier) and then the 3e idea of going beyond to battling in the Cosmos (Paragon to Epic).&nbsp; This also was sort of implied in AD&amp;D, but to a much SMALLER idea than the Adventurers to Heroes idea, in that around 16th - 20th level (depending on Class) you are suddenly these guys taking on the Arch Devils and Demon Lords and such (H4 for example, in which you attempt to destroy Orcus himself).5th edition has you top out at 20th level instead of 9th - 12th level.&nbsp; After that it also has a sort of continuing adventure thing, just like AD&amp;D did, but with Epic Boons and and such.&nbsp; You can continue to grow your character, but with slightly different applications of the rules.To understand the change of the game for someone who never really played it, I suppose the best analogy for that would be to look at 5e with 20th level characters capping out and look at how the game advances after that.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="GreyLord, post: 8555026, member: 4348"] 9th level (for Fighters and Warriors at least, 10th for Rogues/Thieves, 11th for Wizards/Mages, and also 9th for Clerics/Priests unless you were a druid and then it was 12th, 8th for Monks and Barbarians) was seen as the end game in AD&D for many. The rules had an implied change about them where the PC has reached the Zenith and become the Lord of the manor. It switches from being the adventurer to the rulers of the land, and as such, many would then transition to being retired or NPC's in the campaign for many. It was a different "ending point" than many games that came after. Various editions of D&D have tried different tiers of gaming where different ideas apply. Even 5th edition does this. The only edition that really didn't do it or imply it as much was 3.X, and even then, they did "Epic Levels" for those who wanted to...though in theory you could use other advancement schemed past 20th level (for example, my favorite was the Swords and Sorcery version in the Advanced Players Guide) and even had 2 different versions to choose from (the one in the Epic Level Handbook and the simpler found in the FRCS). 4th edition had it divided into 3 tiers...sort of copying the idea that you transition from Adventurers and Heroes to Leaders of the Land (Heroic to Paragon Tier) and then the 3e idea of going beyond to battling in the Cosmos (Paragon to Epic). This also was sort of implied in AD&D, but to a much SMALLER idea than the Adventurers to Heroes idea, in that around 16th - 20th level (depending on Class) you are suddenly these guys taking on the Arch Devils and Demon Lords and such (H4 for example, in which you attempt to destroy Orcus himself). 5th edition has you top out at 20th level instead of 9th - 12th level. After that it also has a sort of continuing adventure thing, just like AD&D did, but with Epic Boons and and such. You can continue to grow your character, but with slightly different applications of the rules. To understand the change of the game for someone who never really played it, I suppose the best analogy for that would be to look at 5e with 20th level characters capping out and look at how the game advances after that. [/QUOTE]

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