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Is 5e still full of Save or Dies?
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<blockquote data-quote="I'm A Banana" data-source="post: 6621189" data-attributes="member: 2067"><p>So I'm playing a wild sorcerer who specializes in things that lead to action denial - things that stop an enemy from performing an action, effectively removing them from the fight. Some things to keep in mind:</p><p></p><p>First, <strong>one combat isn't the whole game</strong>. Even if the party dominates in one encounter, they should be having about <em>six to eight encounters in their day</em> to be challenged, and the farther away you are from that, the more powerful limited-use spells (such as high-level spells) will be. All the spells you speak of are high-level effects. These aren't things that casters can do in every fight. </p><p></p><p>Second, <strong>combats are not typically the party vs. one monster, or 4 monsters in a 10x10 room</strong>. An effect like <em>forcecage</em> isn't EVEN a save-or-die, it's no-save-and-you-are-trapped. But it only works on a closely clustered group or a single being. There should typically still be critters that can do things to the party. <em>Contagion</em> can lock down a creature...but only one creature. </p><p></p><p>Third, related, <strong>combats don't happen in a vacuum</strong>. A spell like <em>forcecage</em> might win you the occasional encounter, but what's your target doing when that hour is up?</p><p></p><p>High-level spells can have some limited save-or-suck properties and not break the game because the game isn't balanced on the idea that disabling one monster or handily winning one encounter is outside the realm of possibility for a party (especially at higher levels). Challenge is more than one fight. </p><p></p><p>...and those fights that are typically meant to be one-on-many challenges are <em>Legendary</em>, which....helps, especially if you have Legendary Resistance.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="I'm A Banana, post: 6621189, member: 2067"] So I'm playing a wild sorcerer who specializes in things that lead to action denial - things that stop an enemy from performing an action, effectively removing them from the fight. Some things to keep in mind: First, [B]one combat isn't the whole game[/B]. Even if the party dominates in one encounter, they should be having about [I]six to eight encounters in their day[/I] to be challenged, and the farther away you are from that, the more powerful limited-use spells (such as high-level spells) will be. All the spells you speak of are high-level effects. These aren't things that casters can do in every fight. Second, [B]combats are not typically the party vs. one monster, or 4 monsters in a 10x10 room[/B]. An effect like [I]forcecage[/I] isn't EVEN a save-or-die, it's no-save-and-you-are-trapped. But it only works on a closely clustered group or a single being. There should typically still be critters that can do things to the party. [I]Contagion[/I] can lock down a creature...but only one creature. Third, related, [B]combats don't happen in a vacuum[/B]. A spell like [I]forcecage[/I] might win you the occasional encounter, but what's your target doing when that hour is up? High-level spells can have some limited save-or-suck properties and not break the game because the game isn't balanced on the idea that disabling one monster or handily winning one encounter is outside the realm of possibility for a party (especially at higher levels). Challenge is more than one fight. ...and those fights that are typically meant to be one-on-many challenges are [I]Legendary[/I], which....helps, especially if you have Legendary Resistance. [/QUOTE]
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