Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Is 5e still full of Save or Dies?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="I'm A Banana" data-source="post: 6621189" data-attributes="member: 2067"><p>So I'm playing a wild sorcerer who specializes in things that lead to action denial - things that stop an enemy from performing an action, effectively removing them from the fight. Some things to keep in mind:</p><p></p><p>First, <strong>one combat isn't the whole game</strong>. Even if the party dominates in one encounter, they should be having about <em>six to eight encounters in their day</em> to be challenged, and the farther away you are from that, the more powerful limited-use spells (such as high-level spells) will be. All the spells you speak of are high-level effects. These aren't things that casters can do in every fight. </p><p></p><p>Second, <strong>combats are not typically the party vs. one monster, or 4 monsters in a 10x10 room</strong>. An effect like <em>forcecage</em> isn't EVEN a save-or-die, it's no-save-and-you-are-trapped. But it only works on a closely clustered group or a single being. There should typically still be critters that can do things to the party. <em>Contagion</em> can lock down a creature...but only one creature. </p><p></p><p>Third, related, <strong>combats don't happen in a vacuum</strong>. A spell like <em>forcecage</em> might win you the occasional encounter, but what's your target doing when that hour is up?</p><p></p><p>High-level spells can have some limited save-or-suck properties and not break the game because the game isn't balanced on the idea that disabling one monster or handily winning one encounter is outside the realm of possibility for a party (especially at higher levels). Challenge is more than one fight. </p><p></p><p>...and those fights that are typically meant to be one-on-many challenges are <em>Legendary</em>, which....helps, especially if you have Legendary Resistance.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="I'm A Banana, post: 6621189, member: 2067"] So I'm playing a wild sorcerer who specializes in things that lead to action denial - things that stop an enemy from performing an action, effectively removing them from the fight. Some things to keep in mind: First, [B]one combat isn't the whole game[/B]. Even if the party dominates in one encounter, they should be having about [I]six to eight encounters in their day[/I] to be challenged, and the farther away you are from that, the more powerful limited-use spells (such as high-level spells) will be. All the spells you speak of are high-level effects. These aren't things that casters can do in every fight. Second, [B]combats are not typically the party vs. one monster, or 4 monsters in a 10x10 room[/B]. An effect like [I]forcecage[/I] isn't EVEN a save-or-die, it's no-save-and-you-are-trapped. But it only works on a closely clustered group or a single being. There should typically still be critters that can do things to the party. [I]Contagion[/I] can lock down a creature...but only one creature. Third, related, [B]combats don't happen in a vacuum[/B]. A spell like [I]forcecage[/I] might win you the occasional encounter, but what's your target doing when that hour is up? High-level spells can have some limited save-or-suck properties and not break the game because the game isn't balanced on the idea that disabling one monster or handily winning one encounter is outside the realm of possibility for a party (especially at higher levels). Challenge is more than one fight. ...and those fights that are typically meant to be one-on-many challenges are [I]Legendary[/I], which....helps, especially if you have Legendary Resistance. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Is 5e still full of Save or Dies?
Top