Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Li Shenron" data-source="post: 7931346" data-attributes="member: 1465">Scoffs.... tried to read the whole thread and still not sure what exactly does it mean "challenging". Most people seem to mean it simply as "how likely you are going to die", while a good minority also points to "how difficult to shrug off lingering effects" (level drain, ability damage).What about instead "how much the game forces you to come up with a novelty idea to proceed"? Now that's my favourite definition of challenge i.e. the more you play the harder you have to think, because your previous tactic doesn't work. So to evaluate how challenging a system is, I especilly need to see what happens at higher levels. If the system gives the PC enough "buttons" to quickly win a scenario, then it's not challenging. In most systems those buttons are spells. Unfortunately I haven't really played 5e at high level yet, but at least I expect that between less prepared spells, less slots and the concentration rule, it should be more challenging than 3e.When "challenging" simply means lethal, it's the only dial you need. It's a threefold dial anyway: more encounters, more monsters per encounter, more powerful monsters. You don't need house rules to  change lethality.The adventuring day is a better gauge than a single encounter, so I'd rather talk about a deadly adventuring day. The short rest mechanics complicate things more however, especially if the PC can have healing ability recharged on a short rest. But I understand that in many situations the DM allows the PC to call the adventuring day over when they want, and have a long rest, which essentially allows the players to dial lethality by themselves. I generally prefer not to have all encounter deadly instead. In fact, I am totally ok even with encounters that are visibly pushovers, because I want to see if the PC decide to blow some resources to stay safe or to go cheap and risk accruing some damage before the real combat ahead. I don't see anything wrong in wanting all encounters deadly anyway. It only has to be kept in mind that you can't have both (a) deadly encounters and (b) lots of them in a single day (c) with limited resources. A lot of gamers in fact would like (a) to the point of ending most combats on the brink of death (but without dying) but then complain they cannot have (b) such as finishing a whole dungeon in a single raid, and that's because the game is and has always been in all editions based on (c). If you want (a) and also (b) you have to give up (c) for example shortening long rests into short rest, or at least granting the party a huge supply of healing potions and charged items. Hint: thanks to their constant recharging mechanics, most videogames like WoW or D3 can afford (a) and (b) because they give up (c).</blockquote>

Verification