Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is LIVE! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Is 5e's Success Actually Bad for Other Games?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="EzekielRaiden" data-source="post: 8301970" data-attributes="member: 6790260"><p>It will be, if the people who <em>make</em> games take the wrong lesson from 5e....as they have from nearly every other major entertainment product that sells. I call it the "Watchmen effect," after the poster-child of "a popular work imitated badly by <em>the entire industry</em>."</p><p></p><p>That is, there's stuff to learn from 5e as a piece of design. However:</p><p>(a) the fact that it is successful does not mean that <em>every single part thereof</em> is axiomatically successful, because games (and comics and a lot of other things) are never just the sum of their parts and are never enjoyed for ABSOLUTELY every single component they contain, and</p><p>(b) the fact that a component of 5e was successful <em>in 5e</em> does not mean that it is axiomatically successful in all games always, because every component of an entertainment product exists in the context of the components that surround it.</p><p></p><p>To use a simple food analogy, (a) is analogous to saying "just because a popular carrot cake recipe calls for decorative sliced almonds doesn't mean the decorative almonds are part of why it's popular or tasty," and (b) is analogous to saying "just because baking at 350 for 15 minutes is <em>absolutely vital</em> for making those snicker doodles taste good does not mean that it will be at all good to bake a salad at 350 for 15 minutes."</p><p></p><p>Given that I already see LOTS of fans making these mistaken conclusions on a regular basis, I'm not exactly hopeful. Yes, it is good that 5e is bringing new blood into the hobby, and yes, <em>on the net</em>, this is probably for the best. But there is a shadow that can be cast by such success, and I'm not really seeing anyone meaningfully tackle that.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="EzekielRaiden, post: 8301970, member: 6790260"] It will be, if the people who [I]make[/I] games take the wrong lesson from 5e....as they have from nearly every other major entertainment product that sells. I call it the "Watchmen effect," after the poster-child of "a popular work imitated badly by [I]the entire industry[/I]." That is, there's stuff to learn from 5e as a piece of design. However: (a) the fact that it is successful does not mean that [I]every single part thereof[/I] is axiomatically successful, because games (and comics and a lot of other things) are never just the sum of their parts and are never enjoyed for ABSOLUTELY every single component they contain, and (b) the fact that a component of 5e was successful [I]in 5e[/I] does not mean that it is axiomatically successful in all games always, because every component of an entertainment product exists in the context of the components that surround it. To use a simple food analogy, (a) is analogous to saying "just because a popular carrot cake recipe calls for decorative sliced almonds doesn't mean the decorative almonds are part of why it's popular or tasty," and (b) is analogous to saying "just because baking at 350 for 15 minutes is [I]absolutely vital[/I] for making those snicker doodles taste good does not mean that it will be at all good to bake a salad at 350 for 15 minutes." Given that I already see LOTS of fans making these mistaken conclusions on a regular basis, I'm not exactly hopeful. Yes, it is good that 5e is bringing new blood into the hobby, and yes, [I]on the net[/I], this is probably for the best. But there is a shadow that can be cast by such success, and I'm not really seeing anyone meaningfully tackle that. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Is 5e's Success Actually Bad for Other Games?
Top