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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Elf Witch" data-source="post: 6316432" data-attributes="member: 9037">I noticed that someone brought up putting the paladin in a no win situation. I read this in almost every conversation about paladins. I guess I have been lucky I have never seen this. What would be considered a no win situation and why would DMs do other then wanting to mess with the paladin? There are a lot of ways to deal with a cleric or paladin who are breaking their codes other then completely stripping powers away. One thing I like to do if they are slipping is have their spells not work on them so no healing or buff spells for themselves as a sign their god is displeased with them.Another is to send dreams or visions. Another way to let them know is have another god court them. I did this with a cleric of Heironeous who was becoming more and more blood thirsty and tyrannical so an avatar of Hextor paid him a visit. I can understand why some DMs want a hard fast rule on how to deal with this because they don't want to deal with the cry of DM fiat. They want to feel as if someone has their backs. I personally think this is a major problem with some players the idea that everything has to have a rule and the DM is honor bound to observe and follow every rule by the RAW. It shows a lack of trust on the players part and I think stems from bad experiences with a bad DM.</blockquote>