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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DrSpunj" data-source="post: 1109604" data-attributes="member: 994">What does Briar Web at 2nd level gain over Entangle at 1st level? Here's Entangle from the SRD:So Briar Web has a Medium range instead of Long, but otherwise has the same basics. As far as spell effects, Briar Web does an automatic 1d4+1/lvl damage each round to any creature attempting an action. Briar Web also has the text about providing Cover (so those affected that choose to avoid damage by standing still aren't likely to be hit with most ranged attacks either).So Briar Web is significantly better than Entangle, but I think the improvements are logical. Targets are given the choice to stay put and remain unharmed or fight the thorns, take automatic damage from doing so and potentially be able to get out of the area of effect.Let's also compare Briar Web to Web, arguably a much fairer comparison since Web is also a 2nd level spell. Here's the SRD version:So Briar Web has double the radius of Web, but only lasts 1/10 as long. Web can be cast usefully most anywhere, while Briar Web is restricted to vegetative areas.Effect-wise Web always entangles a creature while a successful Reflex save avoids entangling in a Briar Web, instead it deals the 1d4+1/lvl damage. Web only deals damage with the addition of fire, and doing so ends the entangling effect since the square is cleared.Both similarly force checks to break the entangle effect (though the Escape Artist check is 5 higher for Web), reduce movement (it's a bit harder to move through a Web, but the smaller area means you're probably out sooner) and provide cover.So, is Briar Web out of line for a 2nd level Druid spell? Well, looking at the rDMG Guidelines for Creating New Spells on pgs. 35-36, maybe not. They aren't much, but they do point out a few things:<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Spells of limited use (like must be cast in a vegetative area) can be more powerful than others of their level</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Druids are best at spells dealing with plants & animals (duh!)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">It's not overly offensive, flashy or dramatic (since each target can choose to stay put without taking ANY damage; yes it takes them effectively out of the fight and restricts movement, but those are defensive effects) so there's no reason it shuts out the Sorcerer or Wizard</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Max damage for a Divine spell affecting multiple targets is a single die (that could be up to a d8)</li> </ul>After all this, I guess I would slightly revise it, but not to any degree that would have affected our game last night. I think the 1d4 damage is fine, but I think the +1/lvl damage should either have a cap (like max +5 similar to the Cure Light Wounds since this affects multiple targets multiple rounds) but this means its most powerful at low levels OR it should be reduced to +1 per 2 levels so that it scales better and ends up being still fairly powerful at higher levels. Last night the latter would've been 1d4+2 for Rowan, which still would've likely killed some of your goblin stooges, Nail, but not statistically all of them. And your sergeant would've had an easier time as well.Otherwise I think it's very comparable to Web (which holds you tighter in a smaller area, but allows you to take most any action you want). The difference in power it has over Web I think is balanced with its lack of utility & castability in any non-vegetative area. Since we're heading (hopefully) under Aldur's Look it's now useless, while Tieran's Web will be just as strong as it always is. While we're travelling and fighting in the forest I want Rowan to shine, 'cuz that's where Druids are da bomb, you know?  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" /> DrSpunj</blockquote>

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