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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Janx" data-source="post: 5644629" data-attributes="member: 8835">actually, the definition I gave didn't exclude computer games, it excluded SOME computer games.Now to demonstrate my power of changing my mind.Taking Umbran and Ahnenois's handy research, they found this:merriam-webster.com1. a (1) : activity engaged in for diversion or amusement : play (2) : the equipment for a game As a programmer, I see the intent, and the flaws in that statement.  Reading a book is "activity engaged in for diversion or amusement" yet it is clearly not a game.  The definition is not exclusive enough.A better definition would be:activity engaged in for diversion or amusement that has rules of engagement.Reading a book (which uses a skill) doesn't really have any rules.  Waging war, which has rules of engagement, isn't really meant to be done as a diversion or for amusement.Anyway, with that modified definition (which still closely resembles the other dictionaries), then D&D has to be a game.The original definition I gave, is really an extension of the dictionary definition, with the added clause that it must also be competitive (the winning/losing thing).By the dictionary definition (even with my modification), lots of things get to qualify as a game. i do need to accept that "even the dictionary says I'm wrong"However, I also posit that the dictionary's answer is just too broad.If you ask any non gamer what a game is, they'll probably give you my original definition.  its only us gamers that have broadened the scope.  Normal people (and I use that term loosely) don't overthink this stuff.In any event, I suspect Game needs categories, and Competitive and Open-Ended would probably be 2 of them.Monopoly being Competitivetag and D&D being Open-EndedPart of my intent, is to question people's thinking that D&D is a game, just like Monopoly is a game.  By dictionary, yes.  But they are worlds apart.  So far apart, that ideas you have about Monopoly do not necessarily apply to D&D.  As was the case of "Is D&D Art?"  or the unbiased nature of GMs in sandboxes.D&D is a fuzzy animal, and there's stuff to it that make it more than a normal game.</blockquote>

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