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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ahnehnois" data-source="post: 5640135" data-attributes="member: 17106">Apologies for not attributing that quote. I put it in because it's a statement that jumped out at me as being a complete aberration, but when I thought about it I wondered if it might not be the prevailing opinion. It's certainly not wrong, I just honestly don't know what you're playing D&D for if not to create a story. The circular statement at the end there didn't really satisfy my curiosity.***[RAMBLE]Personally, I was exposed to a great deal of creative training as a child, but this was later taken away from me. When I first came to D&D, I looked at it as a sort of strategy game you played with friends; sort of a step up from the Pokemon TCG that was all the rage at the time.However, as I learned the rules, I realized that even though I had essentially given up on becoming a dramatist professionally, the game provided a wonderful avenue for creative expression. I kicked off my DMing career with epic plots loosely inspired by favorite books and movies, but I look at my current games more like episodic television.I listen to a lot of director's commentaries and I base my preparation on them. I include a variety of references and allusions at various levels of depth. I narrativize and post reviews after every session. Everything I run has a philosophical "point".I don't dress up or even do particularly good voice acting or otherwise roleplay specific characters in detail (as some here might); for me it's more about the intellectual aspect. So I certainly see D&D as being a game and being artistic, but I see the creative, right-brain aspect as being more fundamental than the tactical rules or the visceral aspect of combat. To me, D&D has more in common with storytime around the campfire or other forms of impromptu, improvisational art than with a tactical miniatures game.So why play D&D? Why not some rules-lite or narrativist game with less combat?Despite my artistic aspirations, I do still see the fun in combat.For instance, when reading LotR (source material for most of us) I didn't pay much attention to any of the war aspect. It was basically about Frodo, Sam, and Gollum or about dramatic tension building as you waited for Aragorn and Gandalf to shut up so the ring and its party could return to focus. However, when people came in to watch the movies, they expected big battle scenes. The visual medium is better suited to such thrills, and the big special effects scenes punctuated the films in a unique way, without overshadowing the human drama. Thus, I didn't even remember the name "Pellinor Fields" from the book, but was able to appreciate what it added to the film.I view combat in D&D the same way. The medium, instead of allowing for hordes of computer generated orcs, allows for characters to have detailed and powerful abilities at the control of the players, and using those grants a certain visceral thrill that punctuates the drama. So my sessions have fights, but they're like a condiment that I'm adding to the main meal.[/RAMBLE]This is a key point for me. There are exceptions, but in general, games have winners and losers and I play to win. D&D, however, is not adversarial and has no defined outcomes. The free-form aspect of D&D as compared to a tactical wargame I find more "artsy".Certainly, art and game are not mutually exclusive.Illustrative of the low barrier of entry to be considered art.Interesting alternative definition. Hadn't thought about it that way. But D&D certainly has an effect on people that mirrors the more traditional experience of art.I'm not sure that one has to create art through conscious effort. Some people might casually break into song, for example, without artistic aspirations, but the results are still music. As far as cliches over deep plot, there are many movies in theaters right now that make the same choice in order to be easily identifiable to the viewers. Michael Bay films are art, for example (although critics don't seem to think they're very good art).I do, however, understand the point being made. While the goal of D&D is not to win, it also does not generally involve an effort to produce art or a concrete product that could be described as such.Ditto.There are people out there who podcast live play recordings, so someone outside the game is consuming them. However, I agree in principle that unlike most art, D&D is generally for the participants, not for an audience.***Keep it coming, folks. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f60e.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":cool:" title="Cool    :cool:"  data-smilie="6"data-shortname=":cool:" /></blockquote>

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