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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Shard O'Glase" data-source="post: 247973" data-attributes="member: 1134">Just to add to James McMurray's post, unsaveable otilicks sphere.  By the rules a wall of force used to trap is unsaveable and only 5th level, so not a big deal.  Slightly OT but blade barrier for me is a bad example beacuse it breaks the rules and is an 8th level spell in my game.  And I think maybe it should be 9th.  It is an area of effect spell that does up to 20d6, at 6th level that beats the arcane damage caps.  Sure reflex negates, but it also provides cover, and lasts for multile rounds which much more than makes up for the save negates.</blockquote>