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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 8063668" data-attributes="member: 6801228">Again, though, that vampire can't be intimidated unless you deceive them first. And If I have the time to draw a circle, and the skill to decieve them... why do I even need the intimidation? I've already convinced them that I am one move away from killing them. It seems like you see Intimidation as "sealing the deal", like, having the power to kill someone or convincing you to kill you can kill them isn't enough. You also have to succeed an intimidation check. But, in most of the games I've been in, if you already have that much power over a person, you just succeed.Except the "situation" is that the DM is fiating and deciding that a skill won't work before you go to roll. If the DM doesn't decide that the Guard cannot possibly be persuaded, then persuasion is still an option. And if both are an option, persuasion is the better choice.Beasts and idiots. How dangerous. Meanwhile the con artist is using deception and Persuasion to convince Lords to donate hundreds of gold to the cause. But I got a bear to run away instead of having a six second combat where I killed it. Well, this is clearly a different experience. Generally, I don't see commoners acting like suicidal death cultists... unless they are secretly suicidal death cultists. Generally... they want to live, and not cause issues by not stepping 3 ft to the side to let the incredibly obviously dangerous person walk past.That plays into the point though. I don't need all of that set up for deception of Persuasion. But I do for intimidation to even have a chance. But you might persuade the Lich to an alliance, or that sparing your lives is a better investment, or that killing you is too much trouble. The goal isn't always to "defeat" the encounter.Right, it didn't have to involve violence because you had leverage of him being a criminal. But, if he isn't a criminal, then what kind of leverage can you possibly have? You can't get a member in good standing kicked out for no reason, so what is your plan to intimidate a man who has no criminal past, if not to start threatening other things. And the good/evil conversation is not pointless. Many games have "no evil characters" as a clause. And, acting like a bad gangster film is going to qualifiy as evil, making Intimidation worth less in those games, because most of it's uses are not things good characters would do.</blockquote>

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