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Message: <blockquote data-quote="EzekielRaiden" data-source="post: 9538474" data-attributes="member: 6790260">Slight hyperbole. It's had this problem in nearly every edition (4e being the major exception, as Intimidate was the way to do what early-editions would have called "Morale checks" to cow enemies into surrender.)Basically, Intimidate is seen as the Bad Guy Persuasion Skill. It almost invariably makes the target hate you, which, as anyone who has actually read Machiavelli should know, is the single most important thing to avoid doing. If you truly must choose between being feared (=respected/understood that you will carry through on your promised punishments) and being loved (=revered/understood that you will carry through on your promised rewards), then being feared is narrowly more reliable, but you absolutely must avoid becoming hated. If you become hated, people will actively accept burdens and suffering in order to hurt you. This is the critical lesson that every "take that!" story at Machiavelli always fails to note.The problem is, DMs hear Intimidate and they think "ah, yes, the skill that makes people do what you want, and then hate you afterward." Any skill predicated on that description will always be a long-term dud, because it is predicated on leaving an ever-growing string of people who hate you and want to take you down a peg or three.The funny thing is, Mike Mearls did work on 4e. That said, much of what I have heard has indicated...something more or less like what you describe, regarding Mr. Mearls' work on 4e, that he basically never accepted any of its internal premises and always tried to force it into being 3e, which...generally did not have good results.See above. The description does nothing to help, and in fact significantly encourages DMs to think of Intimidate as "Persuasion, except it always makes people hate you." Such an interpretation turns Intimidate into being an always-losing proposition--you just might get some minor and/or temporary benefits along with earning a permanent enemy.</blockquote>

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