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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Henry" data-source="post: 1869092" data-attributes="member: 158">Points of disagreement, based on the half-dozen D&D groups I played in from 1987 to 1994:Just like I can't imagine a 1st edition AD&D fighter without at LEAST a Girdle of Hill Giant Strength. In those days, it was the dream of every fighter to own one of two things: A Rod of Lordly Might, and a Girdle of Storm Giant strength. The impossible dream (one I only saw once) was the Hammer of Thunderbolts, the Gauntlets of Ogre Power, and the Girdle of Storm Giant strength, together. It always tickled me to think of someone rolling a 1d4 (base warhammer die) + 23 for damage - why roll the die at all? <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" />Gridle of Giant Strength aside (even in Basic D&D it gave you "to hit" of a hill giant"), back in the old days, stats were of PRIMARY importance in the D&D groups I played in. It was why we NEVER rolled 3d6 for stats in AD&D; everyone always had their crazy little stat-rolling method, from 5d6, drop lowest two dice, to a pool of 16d6, start with 8's, add the dice to your scores, but you can't go above 18. I even used 1d10+8 because I got tired of all the pools of dice rolling in the games. No fighter in 1E would even THINK of going around with a 14 STR or a 12 CON in my old games because the monsters he faced would cream his party silly.I have to disagree based on my experience, because if one compares a 2nd edition 15th level character with no magic whatsoever to a 2nd edition 15th level character with appropriate amount of magic for someone who'd been adventuring that long, the comparison is like night and day. One vastly outstrips the other, same as it does now - only now, the outstripping would be slightly less because of the added magical boosts in 3E that the cleric and wizard are supplying that weren't present back then.</blockquote>

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