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General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Is it fair to cast save-or-suck spells on the players?
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<blockquote data-quote="Blue" data-source="post: 7150878" data-attributes="member: 20564"><p>[MENTION=32659]Charles Rampant[/MENTION], reading the other thread, I think that part of the issue is that your party has left itself a big glaring weakness in terms of spells in that they have no counterspell nor many of the common escapes (short range teleport vs. forcecage, etc.)</p><p></p><p>So this comes across a bit more like "we only made ranged characters, melee attackers are unfair". This really should be standard fair for them once they've hit 19th.</p><p></p><p>Now, if up to this time you've only been throwing opponents at them that do HP damage, which the seem to accept having to mitigate, it could be that they didn't feel like that was part of the "environment". But if that's been happening I don't get where it's coming from.</p><p></p><p>The fact that they were traveling to another plane made some of the spells rougher in ways that normally only apply to foes, and it's not considered a design failure when you get to banish a foe. The fact that at 19th level they had no way to rejoin the party is a bit surprising, either to pull the banished character back, to have the banished character get there under their own power, or to have the banished character utilize items/NPCs on their home plane to get back. Maybe not in time for the fight, but one fight isn't an "unfair" amount of time to sit out, even if it is a climatic one.</p><p></p><p>BTW, fair and fun are two different circles in a Venn diagram. The overlap is a sweet spot. Since from your other thread the players could have walked away with their mission accomplished and instead chose to engage an storied and epic githyanki lich queen with additional liches, a dragon, and other servitors means that if the foes pull out the whoop-ass that's fair.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Blue, post: 7150878, member: 20564"] [MENTION=32659]Charles Rampant[/MENTION], reading the other thread, I think that part of the issue is that your party has left itself a big glaring weakness in terms of spells in that they have no counterspell nor many of the common escapes (short range teleport vs. forcecage, etc.) So this comes across a bit more like "we only made ranged characters, melee attackers are unfair". This really should be standard fair for them once they've hit 19th. Now, if up to this time you've only been throwing opponents at them that do HP damage, which the seem to accept having to mitigate, it could be that they didn't feel like that was part of the "environment". But if that's been happening I don't get where it's coming from. The fact that they were traveling to another plane made some of the spells rougher in ways that normally only apply to foes, and it's not considered a design failure when you get to banish a foe. The fact that at 19th level they had no way to rejoin the party is a bit surprising, either to pull the banished character back, to have the banished character get there under their own power, or to have the banished character utilize items/NPCs on their home plane to get back. Maybe not in time for the fight, but one fight isn't an "unfair" amount of time to sit out, even if it is a climatic one. BTW, fair and fun are two different circles in a Venn diagram. The overlap is a sweet spot. Since from your other thread the players could have walked away with their mission accomplished and instead chose to engage an storied and epic githyanki lich queen with additional liches, a dragon, and other servitors means that if the foes pull out the whoop-ass that's fair. [/QUOTE]
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Is it fair to cast save-or-suck spells on the players?
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