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<blockquote data-quote="Lord Pendragon" data-source="post: 552547" data-attributes="member: 707">I've read a lot of crazy stuff in this thread.&nbsp; Excuses for bad behavior seem the order of the day, from &quot;they're just being guys&quot; to &quot;they thought you were one of the guys,&quot; to &quot;they didn't mean it,&quot; to &quot;it was just a bad day.&quot;Respectfully, to those who made such excuses, I find the whole thing a load of B.S.&nbsp; I'm a man.&nbsp; And I've played with other men and women for years who would find this sort of behavior disgusting.&nbsp; That they're gamers doesn't mean it's less disgusting.To start off, these guys began by consistently calling their one female member a wench.&nbsp; We all know what connotations come attached to that word.&nbsp; We all know the kind of behavior we'd expect from someone who calls women by that term.&nbsp; To use a modern equilvalent, it'd be as if I turned to any woman and said, &quot;Woman, get me a beer!&quot;&nbsp; It's an insult.&nbsp; Not the worst insult imaginable, no, but an insult nonetheless.&nbsp; Ask yourself this: would you call your mother a wench?These guys basically took D&amp;D, and used it as an excuse to be disrespectful to a woman.&nbsp; If they didn't get a kick out of it, if it wasn't naughty in some way, they wouldn't have done it in the first place.&nbsp; It's because they know it's chauvanist, and because it can easily be explained away under the pretense that it's &quot;part of the game&quot; that they did it.&nbsp; And the only reason they stopped doing it is because she asked that they do so.Now they're making sexist jokes.&nbsp; The fact that they haven't up to this point doesn't make what they're doing any more acceptable.&nbsp; The mere fact that they're guys is no excuse.&nbsp; In fact, I'm offended by the very idea.If you see these people as your friends, then as a friend ask them to stop making jokes about your sex.&nbsp; If they really are your friends, they'll stop and they'll feel sorry that they've made you unconfortable, not angry that you're censoring what they say.&nbsp; If they don't stop, then they don't care, and cliche as it is to say in these kinds of threads: you should find another group.To make another analogy which I do not think is too strong:&nbsp; I am an Asian-American and my last gaming group was all White.&nbsp; My friends never made &quot;chink&quot; jokes at the gaming table because they felt I was &quot;one of the guys.&quot;&nbsp; And I certainly wouldn't have made excuses for them if they had.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Lord Pendragon, post: 552547, member: 707"] I've read a lot of crazy stuff in this thread. Excuses for bad behavior seem the order of the day, from "they're just being guys" to "they thought [i]you[/i] were one of the guys," to "they didn't mean it," to "it was just a bad day." Respectfully, to those who made such excuses, I find the whole thing a load of B.S. I'm a man. And I've played with other men and women for years who would find this sort of behavior disgusting. That they're gamers doesn't mean it's less disgusting. To start off, these guys began by consistently calling their one female member a wench. We all know what connotations come attached to that word. We all know the kind of behavior we'd expect from someone who calls women by that term. To use a modern equilvalent, it'd be as if I turned to any woman and said, "Woman, get me a beer!" It's an insult. Not the worst insult imaginable, no, but an insult nonetheless. Ask yourself this: would you call your mother a wench? These guys basically took D&D, and used it as an excuse to be disrespectful to a woman. If they didn't get a kick out of it, if it wasn't [i]naughty[/i] in some way, they wouldn't have done it in the first place. It's [i]because[/i] they know it's chauvanist, and because it can easily be explained away under the pretense that it's "part of the game" that they did it. And the only reason they stopped doing it is because she asked that they do so. Now they're making sexist jokes. The fact that they haven't up to this point doesn't make what they're doing any more acceptable. The mere fact that they're guys is no excuse. In fact, I'm offended by the very idea. If you see these people as your friends, then as a friend ask them to stop making jokes about your sex. If they really [i]are[/i] your friends, they'll stop and they'll feel sorry that they've made you unconfortable, not angry that you're censoring what they say. If they don't stop, then they don't care, and cliche as it is to say in these kinds of threads: you should find another group. To make another analogy which I do not think is too strong: I am an Asian-American and my last gaming group was all White. My friends never made "chink" jokes at the gaming table because they felt I was "one of the guys." And I certainly wouldn't have made excuses for them if they had. [/QUOTE]

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