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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Yaarel" data-source="post: 9659837" data-attributes="member: 58172">In the effort to try balance the six abilities, both conceptual flavor must saliently make sense, and mechanical benefits must strictly balance. This means, any future system that works, will shift in meaning and-or gain or lose mechanics.Most of the permutations of the six have fatal flaws. I am currently looking the following arrangement that might work.Physical = Strength (Attack) + Dexterity (save to avoid) + Constitution (save to withstand)Mental = Wisdom (DC) + Intelligence (save to avoid) + Charisma (save to withstand)Notable features of this arrangement:STR and WIS are extremely powerful because they are the only abilities that can grant the d20 Attack bonus or the DC bonus. STR is more abstract in meaning, more powerful and effective, whether agile or tough. All spellcasters rely on WIS to set the spell DC. Wisdom is moreorless the "magic ability". Beyond this very powerful DC bonus, there needs to be a ribbon to make it interesting.When arranging the mental abilities, INT (knowledge-perception) and CHA (social skill) already have many noncombat benefits. In comparison, WIS without Perception and without the Will save, lacks a useful concept. So here the concept is "magic" effectiveness or analogously holistic mental attack. Flavorwise, I can imagine INT and CHA being the one that determines the DC. But mechanicswise, when looking at the other features that each offers, INT and CHA become difficult to balance.Example, the following arrangement might feel "familiar" but seems impossible to balance.STR (attack) + DEX (save to avoid) + CON (save to withstand)INT (attack) + WIS (save to avoid) + CHA (save to withstand)The problem is flavor, WIS is perceptive but lacks knowledge. Beyond the awkwardness of this premise, there is not much for WIS to do beyond the Perception saving throw, it becomes a passive skill. Then the problem is mechanics. CHA has the willpower save, plus many social benefits.Now for this permutation.STR (attack) + DEX (save to avoid) + CON (save to withstand)INT (attack) + CHA (save to avoid) + WIS (save to withstand)It is narratively weird to make CHA the Perception save. Plus CHA still has the social benefits, while WIS has little or no benefit beyond the save. INT is more powerful that CHA, because of having the lore benefits plus the DC itself.So on. Most permutations of the six are nonstarters.</blockquote>

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