Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Is my Paladin (rebalanced) tank ready?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="StreamOfTheSky" data-source="post: 4255175" data-attributes="member: 35909"><p>First off...wasting a feat on Tower Shield Proficiency is a bad choice. Not only is it not worth a feat, it actually lowers your attack bonus, it's so awkward to use. One thing I've learned in general about tank builds: Unless you have a way to actually, 100% guaranteed force a foe to fight you and not go mage-hunting, you CANNOT ignore your damage output. Part of being a good tank is being too fearsome to ignore.</p><p></p><p>As for "taunting," Goad is one option. It's kinda weak because you can only do it on people you threaten, it costs a Move action, and they still aren't really barred from moving away to attack someone else. Best case scenario is: every round, you use Goad, they ALWAYS fail the will save, and you end up trading one attack against teir full attack round after round. And that's the best case scenario. See why I called it weak?</p><p></p><p>If you want to actually physically keep people from leaving you, your best options are...other classes. The specific term for this is "lockdown." If you go to the char optimization boards at wotc's website (under "gleemax"), they have some threads on this. The two best classes for this are Crusader (with Iron Guard's Glare and/or Thicket of Blades stance, ShieldBlock/Counter maneuvers are also nice) from Tome of Battle, and (in a distant second) the Knight from the Player's Handbook 2, because his Bulwark of Defense class feature (with reach weapon and armor spikes) lets a medium human make all 10 ft around him difficult terrain. This means enemies can't move away from you safely with 5 ft steps, and makes tumbling harder. They also get swift action abilities with long range to make foes seek them out.</p><p></p><p>If you want to stay in Paladin, you're going to have to rely on feats and maybe spells. On that note, what books are allowed? Spell Compendium has a lot of useful things. One spell in particular, Knight's Move, lets you teleport as a swift action next to an enemy, if it'd put you into a flanking position. Expaanded Psionics Handbook as a general feat (as in, don't need to be psionic to take it) called Stand Still. It lets you on an attack of opportunity, instead of actually dealing damage, make the damage roll a save DC. If they fail, <strong>they are stopped from moving!</strong> Complete Champion has a feat (name?) that lets you cast all standard action paladin spells as a swift action, which is...handy for any build. If you insist on Combat Expertise, also get Improved Trip, so that you can use your AoO to trip them, and thus stop them. Whatever you do, having a reach weapon and Combat Reflexes is always useful.</p><p></p><p>If you're willing to multiclass into sorcerer/wizard (better as sorcerer), or even take Use Magic Device ranks, there's alot of nice low level spells in Spell Compendium. Benign Transposition is level 1, no save or SR (ie, great on a wand). It lets two willing allies teleport, swapping places. Obvious tactical useage there. Mindless Rage, level 2, is the ULTIMATE tanking spell. If they fail a will save, they <strong>have</strong> to attack you and it <strong>has</strong> to be melee attacks, if at all possible. No ranged attacks, spells, magic devices, or anything else allowed. At all. Side note: Also fun for a flying caster, after laying down nasty things like Spiked Stones to play a game of "catch the balloon!"</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="StreamOfTheSky, post: 4255175, member: 35909"] First off...wasting a feat on Tower Shield Proficiency is a bad choice. Not only is it not worth a feat, it actually lowers your attack bonus, it's so awkward to use. One thing I've learned in general about tank builds: Unless you have a way to actually, 100% guaranteed force a foe to fight you and not go mage-hunting, you CANNOT ignore your damage output. Part of being a good tank is being too fearsome to ignore. As for "taunting," Goad is one option. It's kinda weak because you can only do it on people you threaten, it costs a Move action, and they still aren't really barred from moving away to attack someone else. Best case scenario is: every round, you use Goad, they ALWAYS fail the will save, and you end up trading one attack against teir full attack round after round. And that's the best case scenario. See why I called it weak? If you want to actually physically keep people from leaving you, your best options are...other classes. The specific term for this is "lockdown." If you go to the char optimization boards at wotc's website (under "gleemax"), they have some threads on this. The two best classes for this are Crusader (with Iron Guard's Glare and/or Thicket of Blades stance, ShieldBlock/Counter maneuvers are also nice) from Tome of Battle, and (in a distant second) the Knight from the Player's Handbook 2, because his Bulwark of Defense class feature (with reach weapon and armor spikes) lets a medium human make all 10 ft around him difficult terrain. This means enemies can't move away from you safely with 5 ft steps, and makes tumbling harder. They also get swift action abilities with long range to make foes seek them out. If you want to stay in Paladin, you're going to have to rely on feats and maybe spells. On that note, what books are allowed? Spell Compendium has a lot of useful things. One spell in particular, Knight's Move, lets you teleport as a swift action next to an enemy, if it'd put you into a flanking position. Expaanded Psionics Handbook as a general feat (as in, don't need to be psionic to take it) called Stand Still. It lets you on an attack of opportunity, instead of actually dealing damage, make the damage roll a save DC. If they fail, [B]they are stopped from moving![/B] Complete Champion has a feat (name?) that lets you cast all standard action paladin spells as a swift action, which is...handy for any build. If you insist on Combat Expertise, also get Improved Trip, so that you can use your AoO to trip them, and thus stop them. Whatever you do, having a reach weapon and Combat Reflexes is always useful. If you're willing to multiclass into sorcerer/wizard (better as sorcerer), or even take Use Magic Device ranks, there's alot of nice low level spells in Spell Compendium. Benign Transposition is level 1, no save or SR (ie, great on a wand). It lets two willing allies teleport, swapping places. Obvious tactical useage there. Mindless Rage, level 2, is the ULTIMATE tanking spell. If they fail a will save, they [B]have[/B] to attack you and it [B]has[/B] to be melee attacks, if at all possible. No ranged attacks, spells, magic devices, or anything else allowed. At all. Side note: Also fun for a flying caster, after laying down nasty things like Spiked Stones to play a game of "catch the balloon!" [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Is my Paladin (rebalanced) tank ready?
Top