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Is Pathfinder 2 Paizo's 4E?
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<blockquote data-quote="CapnZapp" data-source="post: 7822970" data-attributes="member: 12731"><p>Specifically: far too many PF2 feats are of the "use this bonus instead of that bonus for this specific action".</p><p></p><p>From a 5E point of view (which the vast majority of presumptive customers will have): "why not simply assume the character can apply his best bonuses in any given instance?"</p><p></p><p>Bluntly speaking: loads and LOADS of PF2 feats could have just been done away with if the game just assumed the simple and straightforward stance of saying yes.</p><p></p><p>From a perhaps less charitable viewpoint: all those feats just try to divert you away from the fact you can't transcend the devs view of what your character class can accomplish. Each class presents a box, and you cannot reach outside of that box.</p><p></p><p>For instance (and this is most baffling): once you select your character class (at level 1) your core proficiencies are locked in: weapon (offense), armor and saves (defense). There is no meaningful multiclass (in the sense that you actually become something of the other class) - a Fighter with Wizard dedication remains 100% a fighter, only with a smattering of spells.</p><p></p><p>This is MILES APART from Pathfinder 1, where every single knob or lever was in the power of a crafty player to adjust.</p><p></p><p>In a very strange way, PF2 comes across as even more bounded than 5E. (It's just that the boundary is tied to level.)</p><p></p><p>I haven't found a single feat that meaningfully lets one character do something others cannot. They're all carefully constructed to only allow things the game considers balanced in the first place. You might think you open new boxes when you pick various feats, but really all you do is release constraints that prevented you from achieving nominal performance.</p><p></p><p>It's still early days (and so I am not yet a master of the rules), but spells seems to be the chief candidate for a true outlet (of achieving things "outside the norm"). As opposed to 4E, that is, where spells were just regular actions in disguise.</p><p></p><p>Feats arent. Magic items sure doesn't seem to be. There's no multiclassing (in the 3E/5E) sense.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="CapnZapp, post: 7822970, member: 12731"] Specifically: far too many PF2 feats are of the "use this bonus instead of that bonus for this specific action". From a 5E point of view (which the vast majority of presumptive customers will have): "why not simply assume the character can apply his best bonuses in any given instance?" Bluntly speaking: loads and LOADS of PF2 feats could have just been done away with if the game just assumed the simple and straightforward stance of saying yes. From a perhaps less charitable viewpoint: all those feats just try to divert you away from the fact you can't transcend the devs view of what your character class can accomplish. Each class presents a box, and you cannot reach outside of that box. For instance (and this is most baffling): once you select your character class (at level 1) your core proficiencies are locked in: weapon (offense), armor and saves (defense). There is no meaningful multiclass (in the sense that you actually become something of the other class) - a Fighter with Wizard dedication remains 100% a fighter, only with a smattering of spells. This is MILES APART from Pathfinder 1, where every single knob or lever was in the power of a crafty player to adjust. In a very strange way, PF2 comes across as even more bounded than 5E. (It's just that the boundary is tied to level.) I haven't found a single feat that meaningfully lets one character do something others cannot. They're all carefully constructed to only allow things the game considers balanced in the first place. You might think you open new boxes when you pick various feats, but really all you do is release constraints that prevented you from achieving nominal performance. It's still early days (and so I am not yet a master of the rules), but spells seems to be the chief candidate for a true outlet (of achieving things "outside the norm"). As opposed to 4E, that is, where spells were just regular actions in disguise. Feats arent. Magic items sure doesn't seem to be. There's no multiclassing (in the 3E/5E) sense. [/QUOTE]
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