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<blockquote data-quote="Pielorinho" data-source="post: 704746" data-attributes="member: 259">Okay, a new super-sweet hypercool way to determine who's affected by Quench:Any creature of the fire subtype whose natural weapons deal fire damage takes 1d6 hit points of damage per caster level (no saving throw, spell resistance applies.How does that sound?&nbsp; It excludes both Remorhazes and fire giants, but includes the obvious beasties; and it accounts for Spell Resistance.Celebrim, I don't buy the argument that this is simply changing the environment.&nbsp; Compare transmute rock to mud and spike stones.&nbsp; Both spells affect a stone surface in such a way that it causes damage to critters (assuming you cast TRtM on a ceiling).&nbsp; The former, however, causes indirect damage:&nbsp; you magically turn rock to mud, and then nonmagically gravity takes over and throws the now-nonmagical mud down on a creature.&nbsp; TRtM therefore allows no SR.&nbsp; Spike stones, however, magically turns rocks into spikes, and these magical rocks directly damage a creature.&nbsp; Spike stones therefore allows SR.Both change the environment, but one changes it in such a way that damage to a creature is indirect, and the other changes it in such a way that the damage to a creature is direct (i.e., directly caused by the magical changes).&nbsp; The general rule is that if magic affects a creature directly, then SR applies.&nbsp; In the case of quench, even though it's an environmental effect, it seems to me that the damage caused to the creature is caused directly by the environmental change; since that environmental change is magical, SR ought to apply.It is reassuring to be a rules-lawyer player who's arguing something to the detriment of my character; it makes me suspect that I'm not a munchkin after all. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Daniel</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Pielorinho, post: 704746, member: 259"] Okay, a new super-sweet hypercool way to determine who's affected by Quench: [b]Any creature of the fire subtype whose natural weapons deal fire damage takes 1d6 hit points of damage per caster level (no saving throw, spell resistance applies.[/b] How does that sound? It excludes both Remorhazes and fire giants, but includes the obvious beasties; and it accounts for Spell Resistance. Celebrim, I don't buy the argument that this is simply changing the environment. Compare transmute rock to mud and spike stones. Both spells affect a stone surface in such a way that it causes damage to critters (assuming you cast TRtM on a ceiling). The former, however, causes indirect damage: you magically turn rock to mud, and then nonmagically gravity takes over and throws the now-nonmagical mud down on a creature. TRtM therefore allows no SR. Spike stones, however, magically turns rocks into spikes, and these magical rocks directly damage a creature. Spike stones therefore allows SR. Both change the environment, but one changes it in such a way that damage to a creature is indirect, and the other changes it in such a way that the damage to a creature is direct (i.e., directly caused by the magical changes). The general rule is that if magic affects a creature directly, then SR applies. In the case of quench, even though it's an environmental effect, it seems to me that the damage caused to the creature is caused directly by the environmental change; since that environmental change is magical, SR ought to apply. It is reassuring to be a rules-lawyer player who's arguing something to the detriment of my character; it makes me suspect that I'm not a munchkin after all. :) Daniel [/QUOTE]

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