Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Is railroading sometimes a necessary evil?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="buzz" data-source="post: 3676560" data-attributes="member: 6777"><p>I'm having a hard time parsing your post, and part of the reason, I think, is that there are some assumptions built into it that are confounding me.</p><p></p><p>First off, the play example you provided doesn't really seem relevant to the issue at hand. You and the player were obviously on different pages about how the game was supposed to work. Both of you were expecting the other one to initiate action to which they could react. That it ended up being un-fun is no surprise.</p><p></p><p>The second thing that's flummoxing me, in both your posts and others, is that it doesn't feel like anyone is talking to each other pre-game.</p><p></p><p>Any campaign or game I start begins with the group talking about what we're going to play, what kinds of PCs everyone would like to create, and what pre-existing hooks exist. I.e., we all know that we'll be playing <em>Eyes of the Lich Queen</em>, that it starts in nation X, and we have some idea of why the party is together to begin with. Ergo, when we start the first session, nobody is sitting around waiting for something to happen. We all know we're here to <em>play</em>.</p><p></p><p>And, even given the linear plots in most published adventures, I'm not "railroading" the players to make specific choices. Nobody is dickweed enough to just have their PC up and leave the party to run a tea shoppe in Korranberg. They know there's an overarching "mission," but I am not going to dictate how they accomplish it.</p><p></p><p>Even if we're talking about more free-form play, I don't see any need to force players down certain paths or remove their ability to make meaningful choices for their PCs. I mean, that's what "railroading" is, as I understand it; you might as well just read them a story.</p><p></p><p>Let's look at your example again. </p><p></p><p>It is not your job, as GM, to sit there and get pissed that the player is not actively pursuing their PC's agendas or putting all your prep work to waste. The players do not exist to justify your prep (and vice-versa). Not to mention, many RPGs don't ever ask the player to define goals or agendas as part of chargen. Ergo, your player may very well be sitting there knowing what their PC <em>can</em> do, but have no idea what drives them to do it.</p><p></p><p>Your job is to <em>create adversity</em>. Conflict drives good play, IMO.</p><p></p><p>So, when that player, for lack of any ideas as to what he was supposed to do, had their PC go home and make dinner, it was indeed your job kick them into action. Ideally, there's some sort of hook on the PC's character sheet; say, a rivalry with another mage or whatever. Ergo, as soon as the PC sits down to eat their Hungry Man, you have their door burst open, their rival rush in, covered with blood and missing an arm, and have the rival say, "YOU! I KNOW YOU HAD SOMETHING TO DO WITH THIS! PREPARE TO DIE!"</p><p></p><p>As long as you don't dictate how this is all going to end, YOU ARE NOT RAILROADING. You're just doing your job as GM. You're framing a scene that demands the player make a decision. This is the GM's bread and butter.</p><p></p><p>Okay...</p><p></p><p>It's certainly true that some players prefer a very laid-back style of play. They want to <em>enjoy</em> a story more than <em>create</em> one. They want to sit back and have the GM drive things forward, only making a few key rolls, or maybe only getting active when combat happens.</p><p></p><p>Now, if you don't really like this, guess what? DON'T PLAY WITH THESE PEOPLE. You're never going to be happy, because your priorities are just too far out of line with theirs.</p><p></p><p>So, to sum up, "railroading" in the common sense, is, IMO, completely unnecessary.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="buzz, post: 3676560, member: 6777"] I'm having a hard time parsing your post, and part of the reason, I think, is that there are some assumptions built into it that are confounding me. First off, the play example you provided doesn't really seem relevant to the issue at hand. You and the player were obviously on different pages about how the game was supposed to work. Both of you were expecting the other one to initiate action to which they could react. That it ended up being un-fun is no surprise. The second thing that's flummoxing me, in both your posts and others, is that it doesn't feel like anyone is talking to each other pre-game. Any campaign or game I start begins with the group talking about what we're going to play, what kinds of PCs everyone would like to create, and what pre-existing hooks exist. I.e., we all know that we'll be playing [i]Eyes of the Lich Queen[/i], that it starts in nation X, and we have some idea of why the party is together to begin with. Ergo, when we start the first session, nobody is sitting around waiting for something to happen. We all know we're here to [I]play[/I]. And, even given the linear plots in most published adventures, I'm not "railroading" the players to make specific choices. Nobody is dickweed enough to just have their PC up and leave the party to run a tea shoppe in Korranberg. They know there's an overarching "mission," but I am not going to dictate how they accomplish it. Even if we're talking about more free-form play, I don't see any need to force players down certain paths or remove their ability to make meaningful choices for their PCs. I mean, that's what "railroading" is, as I understand it; you might as well just read them a story. Let's look at your example again. It is not your job, as GM, to sit there and get pissed that the player is not actively pursuing their PC's agendas or putting all your prep work to waste. The players do not exist to justify your prep (and vice-versa). Not to mention, many RPGs don't ever ask the player to define goals or agendas as part of chargen. Ergo, your player may very well be sitting there knowing what their PC [I]can[/I] do, but have no idea what drives them to do it. Your job is to [I]create adversity[/I]. Conflict drives good play, IMO. So, when that player, for lack of any ideas as to what he was supposed to do, had their PC go home and make dinner, it was indeed your job kick them into action. Ideally, there's some sort of hook on the PC's character sheet; say, a rivalry with another mage or whatever. Ergo, as soon as the PC sits down to eat their Hungry Man, you have their door burst open, their rival rush in, covered with blood and missing an arm, and have the rival say, "YOU! I KNOW YOU HAD SOMETHING TO DO WITH THIS! PREPARE TO DIE!" As long as you don't dictate how this is all going to end, YOU ARE NOT RAILROADING. You're just doing your job as GM. You're framing a scene that demands the player make a decision. This is the GM's bread and butter. Okay... It's certainly true that some players prefer a very laid-back style of play. They want to [I]enjoy[/I] a story more than [I]create[/I] one. They want to sit back and have the GM drive things forward, only making a few key rolls, or maybe only getting active when combat happens. Now, if you don't really like this, guess what? DON'T PLAY WITH THESE PEOPLE. You're never going to be happy, because your priorities are just too far out of line with theirs. So, to sum up, "railroading" in the common sense, is, IMO, completely unnecessary. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Is railroading sometimes a necessary evil?
Top