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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Gadget" data-source="post: 6716871" data-attributes="member: 23716">This is circuitous logic.  The game relies on that ability score because the designers made it rely on that ability score.  While wizards have generally never been particularly MAD compared to some other classes, is making them so a good thing?  Particularly a part of the game that has not relied on that ability score. How? They already have reasons to care about their Con score, making it integral to a large part of the class features (spells) functioning properly seems questionable, especially given the topic under discussion where the effect is arguably, not all that.Well, obviously, because the system requires it.  The question is this: Why?  Is it a balance issue?  Are these effects so great that it would 'bad design' to do otherwise.  What does it bring to the table?You keep saying this like it is the crux of some grand argument beyond debate.  Here's a point: people's expectations matter.  Period.  Whether or not they are reasonable expectations is somewhat up for debate.  One of the main selling points and design goals was to make 5e 'feel like D&D'.  I would argue that that tag line is all about expectations, though not exact mechanical implementations.  No one here is asking for a return to the LFQW or Angel Summoner vs. BMX Bandit, etc.  People want to discuss how the merits of certain options work, within the context of this edition, and sometimes incidental references to how the archetype has generally played or been perceived in the past can be used to clarify a point made on how things work now.I thought we were talking about how 5e actually works.  Are we not?  The point is that 5e has changed the expectations a bit that isn't clearly evident on first blush.  Is that a good thing?  What is the purpose of that and how does it compare with other classes?  It has taken us how many posts for the point to be boiled down to: "If you want to use iconic wizard spells (that are now concentration) spells in combat, you better put a high priority on Con" from "Is stoneskin underpowered?".  That has been useful to me, at least.</blockquote>

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