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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Vaalingrade" data-source="post: 8652830" data-attributes="member: 82524">In 3x, they are literally required to be pains by the RAW and despite extensively rewriting 3e, I couldn't be assed to bother with them because they genuinely had nothing to offer, especially with Metagame as a core level 1 feature.I just call that a 'character concept' rather than a class TGH.Problem 1. Evil is subjective and I've seen Paladins try and crush a good many things I was not okay with players feeling okay to 'crush'.Something the 3x Pally write-up actively avoids rewarding or supporting.Which is why I prefer it as a character concept instead of a class. I see classes as toolboxen and they should be able to support multiple concepts like the 4e and 5e Paladins.So even they can't help starting inner party conflict. Cool. Cool.In 3e, they added the line 'Fights evil without mercy' and gave them the ability to detect evil at will, thus ruining everything.Better. So much better. Let us never return to the Old Ways, but see them as a tearful warning of the past.</blockquote>