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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Quickleaf" data-source="post: 8761772" data-attributes="member: 20323">[USER=7015698]@Undrave[/USER]  Here's some quick and dirty comparison. I didn't do the weighting for % to hit / % fail Dex save cause it was a headache, and I didn't have time, but someone else is welcome to plug the numbers.At the narrow level of just looking at 5th level damage of a fireball versus a 5th level fighter going all out (to the best of their ability in that edition), there's obviously been a change in design approach over the years.Last column is difference between columns 4 and 6.Obviously flawed analysis. Lone ogre. Fighter not optimized for damage. Assumptions about starting encounter distance. Blah blah blah. All of the analyses are flawed in some way. But it's indicative of underlying design philosophy shift.Non-weighted Average Fireball vs. Fighter Damage Against an Ogre Throughout Editions<table style='width: 100%'><tr><td>Edition</td><td>Ogre Avg HP</td><td>Fireball Avg Damage (by 5th level wizard)</td><td>Fireball Damage as % of Ogre HP</td><td>Fighter Avg Damage (at 5th level)*</td><td>Fighter Damage as % of Ogre HP</td><td>Who Rules?</td></tr><tr><td>OD&D</td><td>15 [4d6+1]</td><td>17.5 [5d6]</td><td>116%</td><td>3.5 [1d6]</td><td>23%</td><td>Wiz +93%</td></tr><tr><td>BECMI</td><td>19 [4d8+1]</td><td>17.5 [5d6]</td><td>92%</td><td>7.5 [1d8+3]</td><td>39%</td><td>Wiz +53%</td></tr><tr><td>AD&D 1e</td><td>19 [4d8+1]</td><td>17.5 [5d6]</td><td>92%</td><td>7.5 [1d8+3]</td><td>39%</td><td>Wiz +53%</td></tr><tr><td>AD&D 2e</td><td>19 [4d8+1]</td><td>17.5 [5d6]</td><td>92%</td><td>9.5 [1d8+5]</td><td>50%</td><td>Wiz +42%</td></tr><tr><td>3e</td><td>29 [4d8+11]</td><td>17.5 [5d6]</td><td>60%</td><td>13.5 [1d8+9]</td><td>46%</td><td>Wiz +14%</td></tr><tr><td>4e**</td><td>101 [?]</td><td>12 [3d6+5]</td><td>12%</td><td>18.5 [3d8+5]</td><td>18%</td><td>Ftr +6%</td></tr><tr><td>5e***</td><td>59 [7d10+21]</td><td>28 [8d6]</td><td>47%</td><td>42 [4 * (1d8+6)]</td><td>71%</td><td>Ftr +24%</td></tr></table>*assume fighter with shield and longsword (normal sword in OD&D), 18 strength (18/01-50 for % strength in AD&D), longsword weapon specialization (in AD&D 2e), Weapon Specialization feat and 3-point Power Attack feat (in 3e)**in 4e assume wizard with 20 Intelligence, take average hp of ogre savage (111) and ogre skirmisher (91) / in 4e assume fighter with 20 Strength using Brute Strike daily power***in 5e assume fighter with 18 Strength with Dueling fighting style using Action Surge</blockquote>

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