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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Jago" data-source="post: 6908210" data-attributes="member: 6855130">The problem is that it really hasn't. The limited Spells Known compounded with the limited spell list really hampers expanding on certain concepts. I want to be an Enchantment Sorcerer whose power comes from some Fey Ancestry, but no Tasha's Hideous Laughter or Faerie Fire? A Warlock suits this concept with the Archfey Patron better, and that shouldn't be so.If my powers come from the Plane of Water ... Uhm ... Well, there's Ray of Frost, Fog Cloud ... Chromatic Orb, I guess ... I suppose Thunderwave might be thematic, to represent like a storm ... Uhm ... Misty ... Step?Sorcerers cannot have Familiars. Why? Why is this a Wizard thing exclusively? Sorcerers used to be able to have Familiars too.If I wanted a Celestial Bloodline, well, Favored Soul, but what if my GM disallows that?Well, that's completely out of the picture. An Infernal Bloodline is basically all the Fire spells and Darkness and such, but ... again, Warlock does that better with their Patron.  I'm not really going above 2nd level spells here, and if I cannot solidify my theme by the time I get 2nd level spells, I've got an issue. I only know 4 spells at 3rd level, and between 4 spells, I'm severely hampering myself to get a theme going. I get 1 more Cantrip than the Wizard, but the Wizard probably has like 15+ spells in their book by this point.I know 4. If I take the Fey Sorcerer, let's say, then my Cantrips are probably:Dancing Lights: HandyFriends: Not so handy, better off using my Charisma skills but we're doing a theme here.Minor Illusion, thematic and handy enoughAnd then more than likely Firebolt or Ray of Frost, because let's be honest, I need some means of doing damage that is not a Crossbow.My 4 spells known are:Disguise Self: Decent, thematicFog Cloud: Can sorta be thematic, and it's a handy spellSleep: Also decent at lower levels and thematicAnd then either Crown of Madness, Invisibility, Mirror Image, Misty Step, or ... Uhm ... Possibly Silent Image or Suggestion.And that's my allotment, and I'm already having a difficult time deciding what to take with only 4 spells known because I still need an effective spell. Every Spell choice is crucial. I could have chosen things like Charm Person, which are more thematic, but Charm Person sucks and I already have a High Charisma, so I don't really want to waste a spell slot on that.If I was a Wizard, we still take the same first 3 Cantrips, sure, but our Spells (6 for 1st level and let's say 3rd level, so we know 4 more):Color SprayDisguise SelfFind FamiliarFog CloudGreaseSilent ImageSleepTasha's Hideous LaughterPhantasmal ForceSuggestionAnd this was after a brief look through the book, not really putting a lot of thought into it.Already, the Wizard at 3rd level is much more thematically appropriate to the idea of a Fey-based Caster (without just defaulting to Warlock) than the Sorcerer is, when the Sorcerer could realistically have Archfey blood in them and therefore be tied to this theme much more strongly than some nerd with a book. The Sorcerer should be able to evoke lots of different backgrounds and themes, but because of limited spell choice and availability, more often than not we're going to get the Gold/Red Dragons with Fire Spells because that mechanically works better than others. It sucks that if I wanted to go with a Sorcerer other than "I blow stuff up", I am actively hampering myself than if I had just gone Wizard and took the appropriate spells, of which I have many, many more. No class should force me to choose weaker options just to pick a theme. I can be a Sword and Board fighter just as much as I can be a Longbow Fighter and neither is truly superior to the other (yes, yes, Archery, I know, but bare with me). The fact that the Sorcerer and Wizard are truly the 2 Arcane spellcasters in the most direct competition and I can be a more variously themed Wizard than I can a Sorcerer is a shame.</blockquote>

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