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<blockquote data-quote="GMforPowergamers" data-source="post: 5000822" data-attributes="member: 67338"><p>so it is impossable for two people to sit at the table and be happy with there characters hit rate, and not be avengers or have expertise...</p><p></p><p>here are 4 PHB1 only melee characters:</p><p></p><p>hafling Rouge level 26 (all except 1 at will attack a nad...) dagger master/ deadly trickster +13 (level) +8 (dex) +6 (magic dagger) +2 (95%+ CA) +3 (prof) +1 (rouge talent)= +33 vs Nads...</p><p></p><p>Dragon born Fighter level 26 Kensi Demi god +13 (level) +9 (str) +6 (magic sword) +2 (flanking with above CA) +3 (prof) +1 (fighter talent) +1 (kensi)= +35 Vs AC</p><p></p><p>Dwarven Paliden level 26 Hospitol Demi god +13 (level) +7 (str or cha) +6 (Magic axe) +2 (come on everyone gets CA for this) +2 (prof)= +30 Vs AC</p><p></p><p>Elf Ranger Level 26 Storm warden Eternal Seeker +13 (level) +8 (str or Dex) +5 (magic scimitar x2, and magic bow) +2 (can't leave him out of CA) +2 (prof)= +30 Vs AC </p><p></p><p>Now then lets look at a level 30 soldier...a hard fight to be sure </p><p> AC=46 NADs= 42</p><p></p><p>so the <em>paliden</em> is in the worst shape... he needs 16's to hit and only his dailyies have miss effects</p><p></p><p>the <em>Ranger</em> is up next he needs 16's as well BUT he does auto damage, and even twin strike does guarantee of 2xdex mod (16 damage) when he misses...he also has multi attack rolls... his elven accuracy helps too.</p><p></p><p>The <em>fighter</em> needs 11's to hit (op attacks are easier thanks to wis) so he is at 50/50 and is doing well</p><p></p><p>the <em>Rogue</em> is blowing everyone out of the water...he has an 18+ crit range and is hitting on 9+...and thanks to arcane trickster he has 3 rerolls per day...</p><p></p><p>Now if they had a 5th player (a leader) they would all be perfectly viable not only without expertise, but with out ___ Power books, or any other add ons. </p><p></p><p> </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Martial/Divine/Arcane mastery, _____ Mastery (blank is weapon you weild), Blind fight, Epic recovery (especilay for a dwarf), that is just quickly looking at an epic fighter sheet infront of me...</p><p></p><p>Crit on 19+, recover powers when you take your action point, remove fighting blind peneltiies, gain a third wind... all of those are great uses of any epic feat.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I guess it depends on weather or not you often run into langauge barriers...</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="GMforPowergamers, post: 5000822, member: 67338"] so it is impossable for two people to sit at the table and be happy with there characters hit rate, and not be avengers or have expertise... here are 4 PHB1 only melee characters: hafling Rouge level 26 (all except 1 at will attack a nad...) dagger master/ deadly trickster +13 (level) +8 (dex) +6 (magic dagger) +2 (95%+ CA) +3 (prof) +1 (rouge talent)= +33 vs Nads... Dragon born Fighter level 26 Kensi Demi god +13 (level) +9 (str) +6 (magic sword) +2 (flanking with above CA) +3 (prof) +1 (fighter talent) +1 (kensi)= +35 Vs AC Dwarven Paliden level 26 Hospitol Demi god +13 (level) +7 (str or cha) +6 (Magic axe) +2 (come on everyone gets CA for this) +2 (prof)= +30 Vs AC Elf Ranger Level 26 Storm warden Eternal Seeker +13 (level) +8 (str or Dex) +5 (magic scimitar x2, and magic bow) +2 (can't leave him out of CA) +2 (prof)= +30 Vs AC Now then lets look at a level 30 soldier...a hard fight to be sure AC=46 NADs= 42 so the [I]paliden[/I] is in the worst shape... he needs 16's to hit and only his dailyies have miss effects the [I]Ranger[/I] is up next he needs 16's as well BUT he does auto damage, and even twin strike does guarantee of 2xdex mod (16 damage) when he misses...he also has multi attack rolls... his elven accuracy helps too. The [I]fighter[/I] needs 11's to hit (op attacks are easier thanks to wis) so he is at 50/50 and is doing well the [I]Rogue[/I] is blowing everyone out of the water...he has an 18+ crit range and is hitting on 9+...and thanks to arcane trickster he has 3 rerolls per day... Now if they had a 5th player (a leader) they would all be perfectly viable not only without expertise, but with out ___ Power books, or any other add ons. Martial/Divine/Arcane mastery, _____ Mastery (blank is weapon you weild), Blind fight, Epic recovery (especilay for a dwarf), that is just quickly looking at an epic fighter sheet infront of me... Crit on 19+, recover powers when you take your action point, remove fighting blind peneltiies, gain a third wind... all of those are great uses of any epic feat. I guess it depends on weather or not you often run into langauge barriers... [/QUOTE]
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