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Message: <blockquote data-quote="FreeTheSlaves" data-source="post: 8034701" data-attributes="member: 9952">Well I guess we need to run some numbers to see the state of things regarding EKs and Poison Spray.Poison Spray is a Con save, so we can assume the EK is using it against a higher AC foe they’ve fought before with a known modest Con save: the Veteran springs to mind, AC17 and Con+2. I don’t know what a typical EK looks like, so I’ll run the numbers with the stats of a known PC.Level 10 EK versus CR3 Veteran2x Rapier+9 d8+7 versus AC17Poison Spray DC16 versus Con+2Two rapier attacksHits on an 8+ or 65%Average damage = d8+7 equals 11.55 of the 65% hit chance is a critical that averages 9+7 equals 16So average sword DPR = 2*(0.60*11.5+(0.05*16))Average sword DPR = 2*(6.9+0.8)                = 15.4Let’s compare that to Poison Spray and one attack.One Poison Spray attackVeteran saves on 14+ or 35% (so EK succeeds 65%)Average damage = 2d12 equals 13So average Poison Spray DPR = 0.65*13Average Poison Spray DPR = 8.45If we now include one sword attack DPR of 7.7 the combined sword and Poison Spray DPR = 16.15But this doesn’t account for Eldritch Strike imposing save disadvantage, and if so the save +2 effectively becomes Con-3.Therefore, one Poison Spray attack at disadvantageVeteran saves on 19+ or 10% (so EK succeeds 90%)Average Poison Spray damage = 2d12 equals 13So average Eldritch Strike Poison Spray DPR = 0.9*13Average Eldritch Strike Poison Spray DPR = 11.7However we can only say 65% of the time the Poison Spray DPR is 11.7, because 35% of the time the Poison Spray is 8.45. So average Eldritch Strike Poison Spray & normal Poison Spray DPR = (0.65*11.7)+(0.35*8.45)Average Eldritch Strike Poison Spray & normal Poison Spray DPR = 10.56If we again include the sword attack DPR of 7.7 the combined average sword DPR and Eldritch Strike Poison Spray & normal Poison Spray DPR = 18.26Two sword swipes of 15.4 versus Poison Spray and sword swipe of 18.26. Looks like Poison Spray works well with this EK at level 10 versus a high AC modest Con save foe. Doesn’t exactly blow me away as a killer combo, more like a tool in the toolbox option.A 3rd attack versus an extra d12 likely favours the former. That said Eldritch Strike reduces the save chance to such a degree it’d likely be very minor. I suspect the level 11 Poison Spray plus sword swipe still averages higher than 3 sword swipes on this build versus this foe.3 sword attacks = 3*7.7                           = 23.111th level Poison Spray = 19.5 (3d12)65% chance of 17.55 and 35% chance 12.67. 11.41 + 4.43 = 15.841 Poison Spray and 1 sword swipe = 23.54 (15.84+7.7)Wow, 23.1 versus 23.54. Certainly not overpowered.</blockquote>

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