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<blockquote data-quote="Herobizkit" data-source="post: 5641025" data-attributes="member: 36150">It could also very well be that the players are wanting to play an old-school, basic &quot;hack/slash/loot&quot; style of game, where the experienced DM is used to running a &quot;play smart or die&quot; type of game.&nbsp; The latter assumes a lot of rules knowledge that the novice players may not yet have.I mean, 3.x is pretty numbers-heavy.&nbsp; Learning the basic math of combat (which is the second-largest section of the PHB next to spells) is heavy enough, then trying to understand how each of the skills works on top of that... it's a lot for someone who just wants to kill things and take their stuff.Re: Archer Rogues.&nbsp; Gotta say, I don't like them.&nbsp; Getting your Sneak Attack bonus with Archery is tough unless you go first in the round.&nbsp; Normally I'd echo the Weapon Finesse, but most of us forget you need a +1 BAB to qualify for it and Rogues don't get that at first level (which is sad).&nbsp; If the DM is open to alternate character creation, I'd almost suggest the Rogue take the UA Rogue Variant that trades Sneak Attack for Fighter feats, then he could get WF for free at 2nd level.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Herobizkit, post: 5641025, member: 36150"] It could also very well be that the players are wanting to play an old-school, basic "hack/slash/loot" style of game, where the experienced DM is used to running a "play smart or die" type of game. The latter assumes a lot of rules knowledge that the novice players may not yet have. I mean, 3.x is pretty numbers-heavy. Learning the basic math of combat (which is the second-largest section of the PHB next to spells) is heavy enough, then trying to understand how each of the skills works on top of that... it's a lot for someone who just wants to kill things and take their stuff. Re: Archer Rogues. Gotta say, I don't like them. Getting your Sneak Attack bonus with Archery is tough unless you go first in the round. Normally I'd echo the Weapon Finesse, but most of us forget you need a +1 BAB to qualify for it and Rogues don't get that at first level (which is sad). If the DM is open to alternate character creation, I'd almost suggest the Rogue take the UA Rogue Variant that trades Sneak Attack for Fighter feats, then he could get WF for free at 2nd level. [/QUOTE]

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