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Message: <blockquote data-quote="seskis281" data-source="post: 4119031" data-attributes="member: 41593">Of course, the info we're getting indicates that Hasbro/WotC is reacting to this with very clever marketing -- they're going to wait and NOT include some of these things (Gnomes anyone?) and only add them in yearly NEW core books (IIs, IIIs, IVs of PHB, MM & DMG).As I have read this thread I've pulled out all the rule books I have on my shelf (not counting Lejendary Adventure as its a completely separate system - i.e. classless).I have before me:Moldvay/Cook edition of Basic/Expert D&D, circa 1981.Gygax AD&D PHB (1e), circa 19782nd Edition PHB, David "Zeb" Cook, circa 1989Monte Cook, Jonathan Tweet, Skip Williams, 3rd Edition D&D, circa 2000.Castles & Crusades, Chenault/Golden, Circa 2004-2007. (Yes, I consider this a "version" of the D&D game - it is specifically intended as a hybrid between differing editions - 1e'isms meshed with 3e d20 mechanics).I mention all this because the above post makes an intersting point - I can pull out virtually all of these and run a game in which I say "remember, I as the DM am the final arbiter of rules..." The original 3.0 works fine... now, because it is also considered "archaic," and when I say "nope - you can only really flank if you're in a more open space and the critter is focused on something in front of him" they go "ok."The problem I have with the massive supplementary nature of 3.5 is likely to be repeated within a few short years with 4e.... continued, unending expansion of books that give the players "rules" amo to challenge DM fiat.  In some regards, it seems that 4e is a strong step towards "DM-less" D&D, at least in the traditional sense. There are many who would strongly like this concept - the idea of a system so self-contained and clear that a "rules interpreter and rules master" becomes obsolete.  That concept is alien to me when I think of "D&D," but again that returns us to what "D&D" really "is."   If the answer is merely: Fantasy/Medieval setting with basic Classes that progress in levels to explore and combat in Dungeon/City/Wilderness encounter areas, then yes.... 4e is as much "D&D" as is Gygaxian 1e. Ultimately, whenever anyone says "the feel" of D&D, they or I are only referring to our own SPECIFIC game experiences.... and I'm willing to bet almost all of us equate different things as being important.I'll shift metaphors here (no more food or cars!):I went to see some excellent Jazz performed at my university's theatre....It was excellent. But....My early love of Jazz included the smokey bar and glass of strong alchohol that accompanied the experience of hearing that music.  So the experience of the recent jazz concert, despite being wonderful musically, just didn't "feel" like Jazz to me. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /></blockquote>

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