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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ExploderWizard" data-source="post: 5083803" data-attributes="member: 66434">There are a lot of interesting viewpoints here so far. I am of the opinion that a hardcoded pass/fail numerically based skill system hurts gameplay more than it helps. Social encounters are reduced to verbal combat style exchanges. Too much energy is spent worrying about the result of the roll rather than what is actually being said or done.  I'm well aware of the skill of the character versus the player argument but more important than that is the quality and fun of the gameplay. If a system is established that takes the joy out of PC/NPC verbal interaction just so some player too lazy to actually say something meaningful can roll a die and expect a result based on the attributes of the social combat munchkin then it suddenly becomes less interesting for the group as a whole. " I use diplomacy on him" is a perfectly legitimate excuse to kill a character on the spot IMHO <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" /> 4E was designed to allow everyone to participate meaningfully in combat. In a social encounter everyone just lets diplomacy guy do the talking unless its a skill challenge where everyone just finds a contrived way to roll against thier better skills whether it has any real bearing on the situation or not.  Part of the whole issue stems from characters being built/designed rather than generated. There are some characters who have charisma as their actual combat attack stat. These characters get to be naturally talented at social skills without have to trade off anything for it. Other characters have to give up effectiveness in combat or other areas just to have a good charisma score. This means that combat is not as separated from the skill system as it could be.  The verbal interaction between DM and players at the table is where the heart of the roleplaying activity is. Skill checks can erode away at the fun of that if applied too rigidly. With all the precision and legalese wording in rulebooks these days the chances of that happening are becoming more likely.</blockquote>

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