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<blockquote data-quote="CPXB" data-source="post: 1472791" data-attributes="member: 17233">A masterful scout when they're eleventh level or more.&nbsp; Until then, any locked door stops them.&nbsp; A long time to wait to be a *scout*.Quality diplomat?&nbsp; You're actually suggesting that monks need to put a decent ability score in Charisma, too?&nbsp; I guess that means they have to get good abilities scores in *everything*, now, to be a good character.&nbsp; Tho', just on the face of it, the bard or paladin is going to be the character you go to in social situations -- indeed, I know in the D&amp;D game I'm in that's precisely what happens.&nbsp; &quot;Oh, a social situation.&nbsp; Send in the bard.&quot;&nbsp; Its sorta their thing.&nbsp; Same with paladins -- &quot;Pally, go make that diplomacy check!&quot;&nbsp; Even sorcerers, now that Bluff is a class skill, can go pretty far -- farther than monks with their frequently abyssmal Cha scores, at any rate.Even the langauge you use to describe monks -- &quot;it isn't always obvious that they're effective&quot; -- compared to finding a druid's &quot;Achilles heel&quot;.&nbsp; Monks, not obviously effective; with druids you have to find their Achilles heel.&nbsp; Which I parse as -- a game has got to be specially designed to make a monk effective, and it has to be specially designed to make a druid not be effective.&nbsp; I think that's a fair assessement of the situation in any event.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="CPXB, post: 1472791, member: 17233"] A masterful scout when they're eleventh level or more. Until then, any locked door stops them. A long time to wait to be a *scout*. Quality diplomat? You're actually suggesting that monks need to put a decent ability score in Charisma, too? I guess that means they have to get good abilities scores in *everything*, now, to be a good character. Tho', just on the face of it, the bard or paladin is going to be the character you go to in social situations -- indeed, I know in the D&D game I'm in that's precisely what happens. "Oh, a social situation. Send in the bard." Its sorta their thing. Same with paladins -- "Pally, go make that diplomacy check!" Even sorcerers, now that Bluff is a class skill, can go pretty far -- farther than monks with their frequently abyssmal Cha scores, at any rate. Even the langauge you use to describe monks -- "it isn't always obvious that they're effective" -- compared to finding a druid's "Achilles heel". Monks, not obviously effective; with druids you have to find their Achilles heel. Which I parse as -- a game has got to be specially designed to make a monk effective, and it has to be specially designed to make a druid not be effective. I think that's a fair assessement of the situation in any event. [/QUOTE]

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