Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Issues with Summon Monster/Summon Nature's Ally (2004 Thread)
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="hong" data-source="post: 1477352" data-attributes="member: 537"><p>Buckler.</p><p> </p><p>In any case, the problem with the monk is not, as had been said already, defense/survivability. The problem is spotlight time. And here, the problem relates to how many players _desire_ to gain spotlight time. In terms of what sticks in the mind or captures the imagination, offense -- the ability to kick butt and take names -- generally takes primacy over defense -- the ability to absorb punishment and keep going. People remember the time that they did 100 points of damage with a critical hit to a BBEG. They don't remember the Fort save they made the round beforehand, to survive the finger of death that the BBEG threw at them.</p><p> </p><p>Now, it's true that there's no law stating people must get their jollies out of the game in this manner. You could certainly set out to create a character that could survive any threat, but also be relatively unable to harm the opposition. If that was what you truly desired for that character, you would probably derive a lot of satisfaction from all the instakill spells and effects you survived, while the tanks and other PCs kept going down. However, this tends to be the exception to the rule. Generally speaking, what correlates most to spotlight time, as individual gamers interpret it, is the ability to kick butt.</p><p> </p><p>Therefore, beyond a certain point, the ability to absorb punishment usually brings less and less satisfaction to a player, if it also means a commensurate reduction in the ability to damage the opposition. For many (if not most) people, the monk has gone beyond that point, especially if you approach it as a class meant to emulate kung-fu martial artists in pop fiction.</p><p> </p><p>That's not to say that you _have_ to approach it as a class meant to emulate anything, of course. If you view the monk purely in abstract terms as a collection of abilities optimised for scouting/mage killing/flexibility/etc, then all of this is irrelevant: you just create a character designed around those schticks. You'll probably not be too fussed about lack of usefulness in combat, because you get your jollies elsewhere. However, that assumes familiarity with the class mechanics and the way D&D plays out in the first place, and requires you to set aside all the background material relating to kung-fu martial artists. I don't think it's reasonable to say that everyone should have to do this, just to derive enjoyment out of playing a base class.</p><p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><p>Heh.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="hong, post: 1477352, member: 537"] Buckler. In any case, the problem with the monk is not, as had been said already, defense/survivability. The problem is spotlight time. And here, the problem relates to how many players _desire_ to gain spotlight time. In terms of what sticks in the mind or captures the imagination, offense -- the ability to kick butt and take names -- generally takes primacy over defense -- the ability to absorb punishment and keep going. People remember the time that they did 100 points of damage with a critical hit to a BBEG. They don't remember the Fort save they made the round beforehand, to survive the finger of death that the BBEG threw at them. Now, it's true that there's no law stating people must get their jollies out of the game in this manner. You could certainly set out to create a character that could survive any threat, but also be relatively unable to harm the opposition. If that was what you truly desired for that character, you would probably derive a lot of satisfaction from all the instakill spells and effects you survived, while the tanks and other PCs kept going down. However, this tends to be the exception to the rule. Generally speaking, what correlates most to spotlight time, as individual gamers interpret it, is the ability to kick butt. Therefore, beyond a certain point, the ability to absorb punishment usually brings less and less satisfaction to a player, if it also means a commensurate reduction in the ability to damage the opposition. For many (if not most) people, the monk has gone beyond that point, especially if you approach it as a class meant to emulate kung-fu martial artists in pop fiction. That's not to say that you _have_ to approach it as a class meant to emulate anything, of course. If you view the monk purely in abstract terms as a collection of abilities optimised for scouting/mage killing/flexibility/etc, then all of this is irrelevant: you just create a character designed around those schticks. You'll probably not be too fussed about lack of usefulness in combat, because you get your jollies elsewhere. However, that assumes familiarity with the class mechanics and the way D&D plays out in the first place, and requires you to set aside all the background material relating to kung-fu martial artists. I don't think it's reasonable to say that everyone should have to do this, just to derive enjoyment out of playing a base class. Heh. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Issues with Summon Monster/Summon Nature's Ally (2004 Thread)
Top