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Message: <blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 2146667" data-attributes="member: 2011">Yup. I caught that in my earlier example yesterday of a Bard making a continuous Tongues item, but forgot already today (like I said, I'm on pain medication and and making mistakes easily).Even so, an item of the same caster level with different spell levels would have that ratio of a lower spell level * 2 Market Value to higher spell level to Creating Cost.In the case of Command Word Tongues, it is 2 * 2 to 4 (or 25,200 GP Bard cost * 2 = 50,400 Market Value to 50400 Cleric Creation Cost).And, it messes up more for the Continuous Items. If the Headbank is Continuous Tongues instead of Command Word:4 (SL) * 7 (CL) * 2000 GP * 1.5 (10 mins per level spell) = 84000 GP Creation Cost Clericversus2 (SL) * 4 (CL) * 2000 GP * 1.5 (10 mins per level spell) = 24000 GP Creation Cost Bard * 2 = 48,000 GP Market ValueThe Cleric drops 60,000 GP more to create the item and it is worth 26,000 GP less than the Cleric paid. The only advantage is that it is +1 more to it's saving throw if it is unattended or if not using the attending users typically better saving throw.He would definitely hire a Bard to help him on this. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> And, there are quite a few spells with 2 levels difference: Anti-Magic Field, Charm Monster Mass, Control Water, Hold Monster, Obscure Object, Refuge, Regenerate, Scrying, Shout Greater, Speak With Animals, Speak With Plants, Stoneskin, Tongues, True Seeing, and Word of Recall. There are a lot more spells with only a single level difference.Detect Poison and Read Magic for a Ranger (and Read Magic, Resistance, and Virtue for a Paladin) are also interesting since they cost a Ranger 8x what it costs a Cleric to make the same item due to CL being 4x higher and the spell being first level instead of zero level (i.e. double cost). Now, this does not apply to scrolls, potions, or wands (at 4x cost instead) because the DMG has specific cost tables for those, but it does apply to other items that require Caster Level and Spell Level.But even so, Rangers (and Paladins) get heavily shafted here on item creation just like Rangers and Druids do on Cure spell casting (a pet peeve of mine <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />) and Cure Scrolls/Potions creation. A Cure Light Wounds Potion at D8+1 costs a Cleric 25 GP (100 GP for D8+4) and a Cure Moderate Potion at 2D8+3 costs a Cleric 150 GP whereas it costs a Ranger 200 GP for a Cure Light Potion at D8+4. 75% of the cost and an average of 140% of the healing (50% of the cost for the same healing D8+4 vs D8+4).This is not really balanced IMO.</blockquote>

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