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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Silverglass" data-source="post: 1211250" data-attributes="member: 14071">Ok then quote me some of this contradictory rules text, not something that "can be interpreted"  or "is ambiguous and might mean" or "a designer has said it was meant to be this way" but an actual piece of text that specifically over-rules the explicit sentence about caster level.I will freely admit that some items have wordings that don't make absolute sense but only 1 single item out of the whole SRD actually breaks what is said in the general rule, thus being an example of a specific rule overriding a general rule. And the principle of the way the rules or D&D are written is that specific cases do override the general rule, this does not however invalidate that rule for any case other than that specified. Having 2 caster level requirements is not a direct contradiction with the rules, as CL and prerequisites are separate attributes and requirements of the item each with their own write-up and the rules as written state that this case may exists and which takes precedence over the other (prerequisite caster levels may raise the level required above the items CL)."For potions, scrolls, and wands, the creator can set the caster level of an item at any number high enough to cast the stored spell and not higher than her own caster level. For other magic items, the caster level is determined by the item itself. In this case, the creator’s caster level must be as high as the item’s caster level (and prerequisites may effectively put a higher minimum on the creator’s level)."This is a completely unambigious statement that the creator's caster level must be as high as the the item's caster level. The caveat about higher minimums is plainly explained in the section on pre-requisites."Prerequisites: Certain requirements must be met in order for a character to create a magic item. These include feats, spells, and miscellaneous requirements such as level, alignment, and race or kind. The prerequisites for creation of an item are given immediately following the item’s caster level."Ok an unambigous statement that the prerequisites must be met during item creation, note that Caster Level is not a "prerequisite" but a separate attribute of the item."It is possible for more than one character to cooperate in the creation of an item, with each participant providing one or more of the prerequisites. In some cases, cooperation may even be necessary.If two or more characters cooperate to create an item, they must agree among themselves who will be considered the creator for the purpose of determinations where the creator’s level must be known. The character designated as the creator pays the XP required to make the item."Another unambiguous statement showing that all of the prerequisites do not have to be met by the creator, they may be supplied by another person. So this is why the prerequisites MAY put a higher minimum on the creators caster level than the CL of the item.Looking at the items themselves:For Weapons and Armour:"If an item has both an enhancement bonus and a special ability, the higher of the two caster level requirements must be met." This does not contradict the general rule but instead supports it and is explicity stated in the sections on creating arms and armour.RingsRing of Protection"caster must be of a level at least three times greater than the bonus of the ring", this does not contradict the general rule which states that prerequistes may put a higher minimum than just the CL as you cannot Forge a ring until you are caster level 12th in any case.Wondrous ItemsExluding the references of "creator’s caster level must be at least x times the  bonus" which do not contradict the general rule in any way there are only 2  items that do have ambiguous text, and I fully admit this.Golem Manuale.g Clay - "creator must be caster level 11th", a strange one as this is equal to the CL of the item and is repeated in the other golem manuals. This makes little sense but any reading does not imply that the CL limit is overriden in any way as the prerequisite is the same as the CL. Brass Horn of Valhalla "Spellcaster level 1st", the real strange one but that even contradicts the simple fact that you must be a 3rd level caster to qualify for the feat.So of all the items listed there a 2 whose prerequisites actually have an absolute caster level specified and only one has a prerequisite that is lower than the items CL. So 1 item out of the whole set has a prerequiste that breaks the rule.Yes some Potions are listed with caster level prerequisites that are higher than the items CL. But potions operate under a separate rule than the one I have quoted at the beginning of this, specifically "For potions, scrolls, and wands, the creator can set the caster level of an item at any number high enough to cast the stored spell and not higher than her own caster level." The caster Level can be set by the creator and the prerequisite may be higher than this but the rules as written about prerequistes state that this does not need to be supplied by the creator.There is only 1 correct way to read the rules as written, even Monte admits this. I have not however said in any way that what is written is what was intended (it obviously was not) or that it is the best way of ruling item creation or that they are not messed up (for some items). All that I have said is that this is what the 3.0 rules said and it has not been errata'd or changed in 3.5.</blockquote>

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