Item creation with other consideration

[Natamanchuk]

I have been DMing my first pathfinders game without much trouble until recently.

My players have gotten to the point that they are creating magical items and it has raised several questions.

In the item creation entry, under “other considerations” it lists a two ways to lower the cost of an item by giving it some restrictions.

Currently my player wants to create a item to give him a boost to his spellcraft skill. Most certainly this is to make it easier for him to create items in the future.

With an bonus of +7 this gives him a maket value of 4 900 Gp, and a creation cost of 2450 Gp.

Adding the following restrictions,

5 ranks of spellcraft required for use, -10 %
Usable only by a Sorcerer, -30 %
Total reduction -40 %

At first glance this does not sit well with me. Can you place a skill restriction on an item that add a bonus to the same skill? Does the total reduction get applied to the market price? Or the Construction price? I have read on some posts that these reductions only apply to the Mark Price in regards to the sale of magical items and have no bearing on the construction of the item.

I’ve reviewed other skill boosting items and there is always a spell involved, that in some way gives a bonus to the related skill or end use desired. I have not been able to find one for a bonus to spellcraft. Is there one that could apply? If not I do not know if this item should be allowed. I know that this item is being created solely to allow the player to make items in the future easier.

 

[GlassEye]

First of all, the reduction is to the cost to make the item. So, that -40% affects your PC's 2,450 gp dropping the actual cost to make the item to 1,470 gp. Note that price and cost are specific terms. Price is how much an item sells for in the market; cost is how much gold it takes for the materials to make it. The section on the restrictions specifically says to reduce the cost.

Other considerations:

+7 seems like such an arbitrary bonus. It isn't disallowed by the rules but all the items in Core have bonuses of +5 or +10. This is likely because they just wanted to provide a couple of benchmark items but you could require him to abide by the same limit.

The rules don't say anything about stacking the cost reductions. You could tell him that only the greater cost reduction affects the cost.

It makes some sense that in order to get use of a Spellcraft item that some amount of knowledge of Spellcraft be required. Making the item only useable by a sorcerer seems an arbitrary restriction. You could simply inform him that that reduction isn't available on this type of item.

You could limit the players to creating only items as listed in the books and not allow creating totally new items.

Lacking a specific spell requirement appropriate to the Spellcraft skill use the general Intelligence boosting spell, Fox's Cunning, as the spell requirement.

Note that most of these considerations aren't supported by 'rules as written'. Sometimes, however, you might need to apply limits to maintain the style of game you like to run.

 

[SteelDraco]

Most importantly, those guidelines are for the GM, not the players. In my experience, letting PCs build whatever items they want based on those very general guidelines is a sure-fire trip to a broken game. Pricing magical items isn't something that can be done formulaically with much success. Let them tell you what they want, and you come back to them with an item at a cost that you feel is appropriate and won't cause problems in your game.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I have no problem with the +7--that's presumably the best he can make or the best he can afford. Either are reasonable reasons for an odd bonus.

I also have no problem with the requires 5 ranks, although I'm not sure about -10% for it. I would be tempted to make it 7 ranks instead. (In other words, it doubles your skill up to +7.)

I would categorically not accept the -30% for sorcerer only. This is just a arbitrary attempt to reduce the cost, it's not a real restriction. Furthermore, it's got a major overlap with the 5 ranks requirement.

 

[Natamanchuk]

I’ve chosen to do the following.

For the Contacts of Spellcraft. I’ve allowed the -10% reductions in cost based on the restriction that Knowledge Arcane requires 7 ranks(or however many ranks matching the bonus requested for spellcraft.)

I’ve rejected the -30% reduction in cost, because I can’t find any way for this to be implemented by a player in a meaningful way that actually works as a restriction.

As for a spell base, having one makes sense to me and it is comparable to most of the other skill boosting items out there. In this case I have allowed my player to use Fox’s Cunning. It’s of suitable low level that it does not have much of an impact on his ability to create the item but it helps it make sense to me.

I have applied a similar stance on this player’s other proposed creations.

I have to say, I love the pathfinder’s system in general. What I have seen of item creation thus far is that it can and most likely will become a much more important and commonplace part of adventuring. Especially compared to 3.5. As such it has become a more powerful tool for the PCs, one that I don’t think they should be deprived of. Only heavily scrutinized.

 

[billd91]

I would generally not allow the PC to discount the creation cost of custom items with limitations. If it doesn't limit the use of item for the PC it is intended for, it shouldn't get a discount. It's just trying to cheese the system.

I would apply that reduced price only if the PCs then tried to sell it because then that would reduce the pool of likely buyers, justifying the reduced cost.