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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Tzarevitch" data-source="post: 1283861" data-attributes="member: 1792">I remember that from Shadowrun too. My DM wouldn't allow my Hermetic Mage to take "Incompetence Orbital Satelite Piloting" as a disadvantage.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" /> I am not sure that is true. In my experience, items created by PCs are no more likely to be upgraded than found items if PCs stumble across something better. In the campaigns that I have played in, unless it was a plussed item that was easily upgraded to a higher plus, it was usually easier to replace the item wholesale than upgrade something that was no longer that useful. That also assumes that you can find someone who can upgrade it. Actually I don't slavishly follow either rule. I allow the construction cost reduction if the player is proposing a real limitation. What purchase price the character can get when he tries to sell it entirely depends on the market. If the limitation is harsh, he isn't going to be able to sell it easily if at all and certainly not anywhere near at "market" value. On another issue, I think using the listed prices for resale of items is nuts. Resale price depends on who is doing the selling (better have a good diplomacy score) who is doing the buying (will the buyer be able to use it himself or resell it at a profit to himself) and what the current market in these items is (i.e. how saturated is the market in the area and how rare and or valueable is the item.) I use the listed price in the book as the best available price assuming all conditions are favorable. While I will allow a 30% discount on the price to make an item with a severe restriction, when the time comes to try and resell it to a merchant, the merchant isn't going to give nearly so nice a price as 70%. Its value to HIM is significantly less than that because he can't resell it or use it easily. If only 10% of the population can even use an item due to it's restriction for example, the merchant would be insane to pay 70% of the value of an unrestricted use version. The merchant will probably only give you 20% or something in that range. As I said before, I have not found that to be true in games that I have played or run. Even then, that assumes that you CAN upgrade the mk1 to the mk2 and it also assumes that it is cost effective to do so. I'll give the specific example that happened to me. In the campaign I am playing in, my Pal2,Cleric(w/ many prestige classes)20 had built himself a Greatsword +3, Lawful, Chaotic with a use restriction called Steel Rose allowing it to only be used by a particular knigltly order. My character used that sword for many a year as it was his favorite weapon. He fairly recently found a Bastardsword +6 Holy Power which he now uses because it obviously is much more powerful. He would love to upgrade Steel Rose to that level but he can't (both because of incredible cost and because he doesn't have Craft Epic Arms and Armor). He also can't sell it because the use restriction is severe enough that it is impacting the resale value because there is only a small number of people who can use it. He won't sell the epic weapon because he can't find anyone who can afford to pay even close to full price for it and even if he could get his price, he can't find anyone who can or will upgrade Steel Rose to a similar level of power. To top it off, Steel Rose would end up being far more expensive because it has other powers (Lawful and Holy) that he can't get rid of. Once per campaign? It happens often in my campaigns. If the wizard has a high-powered staff that is doing good damage the enemy targets him immediately. If the cleric is running around mass healing everyone out of a staff, the enemy targets him immediately. If those characters are the only ones who can use their respective bits of equiptment that represents a critical weak point that the enemy can exploit.Having another PC who can use a staff is not hard. In my parties everyone has Use Magic Device of at least 5 ranks, usually with a +10 skill item (once they can afford it) to insure that everyone can activate critical healing staves and wands when necessary. The skill is no longer exclusive so there is no reason why everyone who can't normally use healing wands shouldn't put a couple of ranks into UMD and get at least a +5 skill item ASAP. Wands and staves are more cost efficient than potions and they are less fragile. If everyone in the party who can't normally use them carries a couple of UMD ranks and a skill item to help the roll the party is better off than if they had relied on healing potions alone. Use limitations are critical problems because it represents an asset than cannot be used by anyone if necessary. Add this to a Staff of Mass Healing of some sort and the problem becomes acute if the cleric is put out of action. Tzarevitch</blockquote>

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