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It's so hard to die!
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<blockquote data-quote="tetrasodium" data-source="post: 8271796" data-attributes="member: 93670"><p>I'm surprised this thread grew so many pages without anyone mentioning how the shift from 3.x's vancian spell prep to 5e's spontanious casting affects the comparison [USER=6747584]@Corrosive[/USER] made . Back in 3.x a healer would need to prepare each spell infividually at the cost of not preparing some other spell in each slot dedicated to a heal. Preparing too many heals meant the healer was curtailing their ability to cast other spells when needed or desired while not preparing enough had the obvious problem of people being likely to die. In 5e preparing a heal spell along with the other spells allows a caster to cast any combination of them in the exact situations needed as often or few times as they have unusedspell slots or needs</p><p></p><p>There was also the negative hp needing healing rather than going away. Yea a wand with a heal spell on it could heal you up between fights, but that's not going to be all that useful in the middle of a figh. 5e by comparison treats getting nicked down by a bad roll from a zombie that eats your last hp as getting crit by an ancient dragon while at1hp</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>You <em>have</em>.. actual experience with 5e don't you? Like at a table in play with others rather than just white room theory crafting? Between your two posts I'm not even sure that your talking about 5e rather than some other system. You need more than multiple attacks, you need one attack to drop a second attack to cross off 2 death saves, and a third attack to execute before anyone heals the target for any amount of health. If any amount of healing is provided between the first and third attack then the process resets. This all pretty much needs to happen on one round because it goes back to the someone heals the target & everything resets to the drop targer>fail2>execute loop & healing is plentiful in 5e.</p><p></p><p>With <a href="https://www.dndbeyond.com/spells/healing-word" target="_blank">healing word</a> limited to druid, cleric, bard, alchemist, some & sorcerers... and healing spells limited to cleric druid ranger paladin some sorcerers some warlocks, & bard it's hardly a real concern that someone has the ability to heal another player in <em>some </em>form. I haven't even gotten into abilities like 1 point Lay on Hands & the celestial warlock's healing light All of that combined is why it's really only an option if the monsters are capable of getting all those attacks in before pretty much any heal capable class comes up in the initiative</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>"it's so hard to die" and "[it's] too hard to kill the pcs" are different statements that unquestionably have some overlap, but the differences are critical. That hard so die one means that concern of the possibility of death is also minimized due to the implausible conditions needed for it to occur</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="tetrasodium, post: 8271796, member: 93670"] I'm surprised this thread grew so many pages without anyone mentioning how the shift from 3.x's vancian spell prep to 5e's spontanious casting affects the comparison [USER=6747584]@Corrosive[/USER] made . Back in 3.x a healer would need to prepare each spell infividually at the cost of not preparing some other spell in each slot dedicated to a heal. Preparing too many heals meant the healer was curtailing their ability to cast other spells when needed or desired while not preparing enough had the obvious problem of people being likely to die. In 5e preparing a heal spell along with the other spells allows a caster to cast any combination of them in the exact situations needed as often or few times as they have unusedspell slots or needs There was also the negative hp needing healing rather than going away. Yea a wand with a heal spell on it could heal you up between fights, but that's not going to be all that useful in the middle of a figh. 5e by comparison treats getting nicked down by a bad roll from a zombie that eats your last hp as getting crit by an ancient dragon while at1hp You [I]have[/I].. actual experience with 5e don't you? Like at a table in play with others rather than just white room theory crafting? Between your two posts I'm not even sure that your talking about 5e rather than some other system. You need more than multiple attacks, you need one attack to drop a second attack to cross off 2 death saves, and a third attack to execute before anyone heals the target for any amount of health. If any amount of healing is provided between the first and third attack then the process resets. This all pretty much needs to happen on one round because it goes back to the someone heals the target & everything resets to the drop targer>fail2>execute loop & healing is plentiful in 5e. With [URL='https://www.dndbeyond.com/spells/healing-word']healing word[/URL] limited to druid, cleric, bard, alchemist, some & sorcerers... and healing spells limited to cleric druid ranger paladin some sorcerers some warlocks, & bard it's hardly a real concern that someone has the ability to heal another player in [I]some [/I]form. I haven't even gotten into abilities like 1 point Lay on Hands & the celestial warlock's healing light All of that combined is why it's really only an option if the monsters are capable of getting all those attacks in before pretty much any heal capable class comes up in the initiative "it's so hard to die" and "[it's] too hard to kill the pcs" are different statements that unquestionably have some overlap, but the differences are critical. That hard so die one means that concern of the possibility of death is also minimized due to the implausible conditions needed for it to occur [/QUOTE]
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