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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Campbell" data-source="post: 7085250" data-attributes="member: 16586">@IlbrentelothThe sort of experience you describe is quite common when first playing and running most indie games, particularly when given convenient release valves like intent, stakes setting, and the ability to add your own complications. First there's the element where you are playing a game that is a lot like the games you have played before so you feel like the skillset you have developed to run and play these games should directly transfer without a hitch, but the skills involved are slightly different. It's like learning how to play a roleplaying game all over again or moving from Call of Duty to Overwatch. Euchre or Spades to Poker is another apt comparison. We don't take tricks in all our card games. Then there's the element where you are giving up the safety and security of perceived sole ownership and control over outcomes. This can be very scary at first. There's also the element where these games require taking social and creative risks we do not usually take when we play mainstream games. Finally the lack of structure can often lead to a sense of anything goes.All this added together can create a sense of creative insecurity, emotional vulnerability and social freedom. When we feel socially free and emotionally vulnerable we often have a tendency to get silly. Some people really never get past this, but most will over the course of a couple sessions. They often just need to get it out of their systems. This is one of the reasons why I feel like most people who have tried an indie game at a convention and decided it was not for them or decided it was the best thing ever don't really understand the experience of really playing these games. They never really got to the point of vigorous collaboration and being really open to the experience.I would really stress the importance of really giving things a shot and being principled, sensitive, and disciplined about how you use these techniques. You do not have to be exploring problematic content for these techniques to be potentially dangerous. Just the general lack of a protective shell around your character and world can be somewhat frightening to many players. It's a lot like playing Diplomacy, Liar's Dice, <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />, or Poker for the first time with friends. Although the same could be said for playing D&D in the way it was originally played. It's also definitely not for everyone. Fair play and trust are very important.      Here's another thing that the most adamant indie gamers probably will not tell you. You can ease into it. I would not recommend combining techniques in the same game, especially at first, but you don't have to turn on the entire fire house at once. I would recommend starting with a game that uses a group structure, provides a structure of play, supports at least broad form setting, and has mechanics you can ease into. The vigorous collaboration can come with time. You can usually safely combine elements of war gaming play with indie play, because they tend to rely on similar permission and expectation models even if the specific permissions and expectations are different. I will get to that in a different post.My personal recommendation for anyone wanting to give indie gaming a shot would be to give Blades in the Dark a shot on some night you would otherwise get together to play a board game. It relies on a group dynamic, has a dynamic if broadly defined setting to fall back on, has a structure that focuses play, mechanics that you can opt into, and a reward structure that will build in conflicts over methods rather than over conflicts. I would start with just the general score and downtime structure and action rolls. You can build in things like progress clocks, devil's bargains, asking questions as suits the group, and things like emotional and psychological harm over time. The vice, heat, and stress mechanics will do a lot of heavy lifting for you. Right now I am playing Blades with a group of mostly mainstream gamers and they are loving it. It's taken them a bit more time to glom onto the principles, but things have never gotten silly or awkward.</blockquote>

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