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General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Judgement calls vs "railroading"
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<blockquote data-quote="Manbearcat" data-source="post: 7097447" data-attributes="member: 6696971"><p>It seems like the conversation with [MENTION=23935]Nagol[/MENTION] and this post and another post by [MENTION=42582]pemerton[/MENTION] (regarding how the GM is constained in affecting the fiction in classic D&D turn-based combat due action economy and the prescriptive, binary nature of most actions) may have sorted this out. But if it hasn't, here is another effort. </p><p></p><p>In one (small with respect to scale and scope) Dungeon World combat the result of PC moves yielded the following:</p><p></p><p>Outright success * 2</p><p>Success with danger * 2 </p><p>Success with a prescribed worst outcome * 1</p><p>Success with a worse outcome, hard bargain, or ugly choice * 3</p><p>Hard failure * 1</p><p></p><p>These are just the reactive moves I have to make. This doesn't even take into account my initial framing (collection of soft moves in establishing the situation) and proactive soft moves I would need to make in the course of play to give effect to my NPCs/obstacles and follow the fiction.</p><p></p><p>Just those alone and you have 5 reactive moves that don't just allow, but require, a significant amount of creativity on the GM's part to (a) follow the fiction, (b) fill the character's lives with adventure, (c) think dangerous, and (d) create interesting decision-points/trees for the players. These aren't in the least bit prescriptive or binary. Each one of these probably entails a menu of 6-12 options (depending on how prolific/creative the GM is coupled with the NPC/Obstacle moves/Instincts, coupled with how constraining the present fictional positioning is) that the GM must collate and decide upon a winner. Then you have the singular Hard failure where the options are either opened up or further constrained depending on the situation.</p><p></p><p>Contrast with the binary, prescriptive nature of classic D&D combat saving throws and the overwhelming majority of action declarations and their attendant resolution? There is no comparison. The creative burden and the creative (but principally constrained) latitude for a Dungeon World GM is overwhelmingly more significant.</p><p></p><p>If anything, the pressure and demands of this improvisational cognitive burden (creating dynamic, principled fiction with interesting/dynamic decision-points while simultaneously coherently addressing the premise the players' have flagged as important/relevant to their PCs) is the break-point for many classic D&D GMs who try their hand at Dungeon World and other PBtA games (see my post a few above this). </p><p></p><p>I've known many that just flat can't do it. I've known others that can do it in short bursts but anything more is exhausting.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Manbearcat, post: 7097447, member: 6696971"] It seems like the conversation with [MENTION=23935]Nagol[/MENTION] and this post and another post by [MENTION=42582]pemerton[/MENTION] (regarding how the GM is constained in affecting the fiction in classic D&D turn-based combat due action economy and the prescriptive, binary nature of most actions) may have sorted this out. But if it hasn't, here is another effort. In one (small with respect to scale and scope) Dungeon World combat the result of PC moves yielded the following: Outright success * 2 Success with danger * 2 Success with a prescribed worst outcome * 1 Success with a worse outcome, hard bargain, or ugly choice * 3 Hard failure * 1 These are just the reactive moves I have to make. This doesn't even take into account my initial framing (collection of soft moves in establishing the situation) and proactive soft moves I would need to make in the course of play to give effect to my NPCs/obstacles and follow the fiction. Just those alone and you have 5 reactive moves that don't just allow, but require, a significant amount of creativity on the GM's part to (a) follow the fiction, (b) fill the character's lives with adventure, (c) think dangerous, and (d) create interesting decision-points/trees for the players. These aren't in the least bit prescriptive or binary. Each one of these probably entails a menu of 6-12 options (depending on how prolific/creative the GM is coupled with the NPC/Obstacle moves/Instincts, coupled with how constraining the present fictional positioning is) that the GM must collate and decide upon a winner. Then you have the singular Hard failure where the options are either opened up or further constrained depending on the situation. Contrast with the binary, prescriptive nature of classic D&D combat saving throws and the overwhelming majority of action declarations and their attendant resolution? There is no comparison. The creative burden and the creative (but principally constrained) latitude for a Dungeon World GM is overwhelmingly more significant. If anything, the pressure and demands of this improvisational cognitive burden (creating dynamic, principled fiction with interesting/dynamic decision-points while simultaneously coherently addressing the premise the players' have flagged as important/relevant to their PCs) is the break-point for many classic D&D GMs who try their hand at Dungeon World and other PBtA games (see my post a few above this). I've known many that just flat can't do it. I've known others that can do it in short bursts but anything more is exhausting. [/QUOTE]
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