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Kara Tur vs Tarkir vs Kamigawa vs Plane of Mountains and Seas vs Ikoria
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<blockquote data-quote="Voadam" data-source="post: 7976045" data-attributes="member: 2209"><p>So I listened to the two hour discussion to hear what they had to say was problematic about the 1e OA.</p><p></p><p>For me that critique left a lot to be desired.</p><p></p><p>More than half of the two hour discussion was dominated by their critique of comeliness as a special stat only for oriental adventures characters and how this tied into stereotypes of ugly asian men and sexy dragon lady archetypes. Only comeliness was a general AD&D stat introduced earlier in the Unearthed Arcana rules book and was not something that did this only to the portrayal of asians. I agree that comeliness was mechanically a bad game element on its own and that the agency removing aspects were terrible but that was a generally applicable problem and not something that targeted asians in particular to make them an other who are the only ones judged primarily by their looks. </p><p></p><p>Also their critique that nobody would have a comeliness stat now in a game system seems to be unaware of White Wolf game systems' core ability stat appearance from the 90s through the present. </p><p></p><p>Similarly they were ignorant of AD&D racial and class ability score minimums and maximums, prime requisites providing bonus xp for classes, exceptional strength, and the normal 3-18 score range from the 1e PH. Also the fact that Kara Tur only became part of the Forgotten Realms in supplements after the OA book. The things they kept getting wrong or discovering for the first time and going on and on about was a bit grating.</p><p></p><p>In reviewing the Table of Contents they had a critique about the focus on violence (Class, Weapons, Spells, Monsters) as what's seen as important to focus on instead of real cultures of Asia.</p><p></p><p>The violence aspects seem typical for D&D where it is generally all focused to facilitate normal D&D Conan/Mouser Swords and Sorcery type adventures and the materials focusing on Classes, Weapons, Spells, and Monsters. The opening inside art having two armed people fighting does not seem problematic for a D&D book.</p><p></p><p>The mixing stuff together (lumping in stuff from Japan, China, Mongolia, Korea, etc.) seems typical D&D where minotaurs (from Greek Myths in the ancient world) and fire giants (from Viking Age Scandinavia) stand against knights in plate armor without a second thought.</p><p></p><p>Not a lot of discussion of problematic cultural appropriation or portrayals of asian materials for gaming.</p><p></p><p>There is a complaint that it was written by three white guys. I believe there is an assertion that stuff informed by lived experience will always be better.</p><p></p><p>There is a lot of sighing about how much damage things do and how hurtful they are without actually describing how or why they are damaging. </p><p></p><p>Some discussion of describing things as like normal X but different in Y ways (Paladin and Sohei) instead of describing them from ground up and leaving the reader to connect dots. This seems more a critique of editorial style choices than problematic issues.</p><p></p><p>I wanted to hear some substantive discussion of OA specific (as opposed to 1e in general) problematical issues, I'm not sure I have the interest to sit through more of this to actually get to some.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Voadam, post: 7976045, member: 2209"] So I listened to the two hour discussion to hear what they had to say was problematic about the 1e OA. For me that critique left a lot to be desired. More than half of the two hour discussion was dominated by their critique of comeliness as a special stat only for oriental adventures characters and how this tied into stereotypes of ugly asian men and sexy dragon lady archetypes. Only comeliness was a general AD&D stat introduced earlier in the Unearthed Arcana rules book and was not something that did this only to the portrayal of asians. I agree that comeliness was mechanically a bad game element on its own and that the agency removing aspects were terrible but that was a generally applicable problem and not something that targeted asians in particular to make them an other who are the only ones judged primarily by their looks. Also their critique that nobody would have a comeliness stat now in a game system seems to be unaware of White Wolf game systems' core ability stat appearance from the 90s through the present. Similarly they were ignorant of AD&D racial and class ability score minimums and maximums, prime requisites providing bonus xp for classes, exceptional strength, and the normal 3-18 score range from the 1e PH. Also the fact that Kara Tur only became part of the Forgotten Realms in supplements after the OA book. The things they kept getting wrong or discovering for the first time and going on and on about was a bit grating. In reviewing the Table of Contents they had a critique about the focus on violence (Class, Weapons, Spells, Monsters) as what's seen as important to focus on instead of real cultures of Asia. The violence aspects seem typical for D&D where it is generally all focused to facilitate normal D&D Conan/Mouser Swords and Sorcery type adventures and the materials focusing on Classes, Weapons, Spells, and Monsters. The opening inside art having two armed people fighting does not seem problematic for a D&D book. The mixing stuff together (lumping in stuff from Japan, China, Mongolia, Korea, etc.) seems typical D&D where minotaurs (from Greek Myths in the ancient world) and fire giants (from Viking Age Scandinavia) stand against knights in plate armor without a second thought. Not a lot of discussion of problematic cultural appropriation or portrayals of asian materials for gaming. There is a complaint that it was written by three white guys. I believe there is an assertion that stuff informed by lived experience will always be better. There is a lot of sighing about how much damage things do and how hurtful they are without actually describing how or why they are damaging. Some discussion of describing things as like normal X but different in Y ways (Paladin and Sohei) instead of describing them from ground up and leaving the reader to connect dots. This seems more a critique of editorial style choices than problematic issues. I wanted to hear some substantive discussion of OA specific (as opposed to 1e in general) problematical issues, I'm not sure I have the interest to sit through more of this to actually get to some. [/QUOTE]
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