Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Keith Baker on 4E! (The Hellcow responds!)
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Vermonter" data-source="post: 4124113" data-attributes="member: 54647"><p>First of all, awesome thread! I appreciate that while folks have their own concerns there appears to be genuine debate and listening going on. Given the amount of speculation involved in these discussions this isn't easy.</p><p></p><p>I wanted to throw in my own perspective. To be up front about it, I'm really looking forward to 4E, but there are some specific reasons why.</p><p></p><p>I played the original red box and 1st ed D&D heavily. Bought into second edition, but didn't play all that much and took a decade + hiatus from D&D. I just came to 3.5 about two years ago and started running my own campaign about a year ago. I would consider myself a very experienced game master.</p><p></p><p>With all that said, I do find the 3.5 NPC rules tough to work with. Not at all because I'm unwilling to just fudge stats. I do that automatically by now. The problem is figuring out what the right stat to fudge is! I have six players/characters all mid level (8), some with LA, some with templates giving them odd abilities, (flight, DR, diminuitive size, invisibility). Some are experienced, for one it is her first and only RP game. Their builds range from optimized to thematic.</p><p></p><p>My goal as a DM is to set challenging but surmountable encounters for them. Quite simply I've found that the CR system doesn't work. So, I end up fudging wildly. But, say I have a creature I like thematically, but I know it isn't tough enough. I want to add to it's AC, attack bonus and damage. HP are probably ok. But how much to add? I end up flipping around looking at other creatures trying to get the numbers right. Other times I just do the class level advancement.</p><p></p><p>On the same token, I have found that they are now at the power point where fighting groups that don't have spell caster support gives my players a real advantage. So now I'm into selecting spells for their opponents for every encounter. Finding the right spells to address the parties abilities and make it "fun" isn't easy. I finally used web to isolate the group in an encounter prompting the new player to ask how it could possibly be such a low level spell.</p><p></p><p>What I'm expecting of 4E isn't the fact that I can DM fiat, it is that the rules will tell me how to do so in a balanced way so I can save a lot of time building numbers and instead focus on the story and cool abilities. I know some of you understand the ins and outs of the system well, but for me, I still need to review half the second level wizard/sorceror spells in the PH and Spell Compendium just to fill out the likely actions of my lieutenant spell caster in each encounter I make. </p><p></p><p>Simply put, 3E is very DM unfriendly for all but the experienced or highly dedicated. Any change to the system that puts more tools in the DMs hands will be a good thing.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Vermonter, post: 4124113, member: 54647"] First of all, awesome thread! I appreciate that while folks have their own concerns there appears to be genuine debate and listening going on. Given the amount of speculation involved in these discussions this isn't easy. I wanted to throw in my own perspective. To be up front about it, I'm really looking forward to 4E, but there are some specific reasons why. I played the original red box and 1st ed D&D heavily. Bought into second edition, but didn't play all that much and took a decade + hiatus from D&D. I just came to 3.5 about two years ago and started running my own campaign about a year ago. I would consider myself a very experienced game master. With all that said, I do find the 3.5 NPC rules tough to work with. Not at all because I'm unwilling to just fudge stats. I do that automatically by now. The problem is figuring out what the right stat to fudge is! I have six players/characters all mid level (8), some with LA, some with templates giving them odd abilities, (flight, DR, diminuitive size, invisibility). Some are experienced, for one it is her first and only RP game. Their builds range from optimized to thematic. My goal as a DM is to set challenging but surmountable encounters for them. Quite simply I've found that the CR system doesn't work. So, I end up fudging wildly. But, say I have a creature I like thematically, but I know it isn't tough enough. I want to add to it's AC, attack bonus and damage. HP are probably ok. But how much to add? I end up flipping around looking at other creatures trying to get the numbers right. Other times I just do the class level advancement. On the same token, I have found that they are now at the power point where fighting groups that don't have spell caster support gives my players a real advantage. So now I'm into selecting spells for their opponents for every encounter. Finding the right spells to address the parties abilities and make it "fun" isn't easy. I finally used web to isolate the group in an encounter prompting the new player to ask how it could possibly be such a low level spell. What I'm expecting of 4E isn't the fact that I can DM fiat, it is that the rules will tell me how to do so in a balanced way so I can save a lot of time building numbers and instead focus on the story and cool abilities. I know some of you understand the ins and outs of the system well, but for me, I still need to review half the second level wizard/sorceror spells in the PH and Spell Compendium just to fill out the likely actions of my lieutenant spell caster in each encounter I make. Simply put, 3E is very DM unfriendly for all but the experienced or highly dedicated. Any change to the system that puts more tools in the DMs hands will be a good thing. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Keith Baker on 4E! (The Hellcow responds!)
Top