Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="n00bdragon" data-source="post: 5861311" data-attributes="member: 6689371">So every other class in the game has special abilities that let them do cool things just by declaring it so but the fighter must use roleplay to be anything more than a somewhat mediocre summon? Are you implying other classes can't use roleplay to the exact same extent to do the exact same things except more because they also have game-system provided powers? The real problem is the assumption it's a good thing for the DM to fix the system's balance problem. This is a strange belief held by a vast number of D&D players because it's been required by the game since the game's inception. No other roleplaying game has such a bizarre player base not just accustomed to but actively preferring such insanity.The assumption goes that characters with "effect buttons" simply declare that something is now happening. Whether that be them turning invisible or clonking a guy on the head so hard he drops his guard and wets himself the fact of the matter is the player (not the DM) can simply declare "this happens". Characters without "effect buttons" must consult the DM for every action they take which is beyond the scope of the rules as written and the DM is obliged to invent rules on the spot. Whether that rule is "no" or "make 9000 strength checks" depends on the DM but for those characters it is the DM who determines the scope of their abilities on the fly rather than the player's character sheet.Continuing the assumption is that characters who have effect buttons will not generally ask the DM to invent new rules for their actions. They will rely entirely on their effect buttons. Likewise it is assumed that characters without effect buttons should always have a reasonable chance to do various things with the rules invented on the fly by the DM even though this "power" is explained nowhere in the rules of any edition of D&D. The unwritten rules are thusly and players who deviate from this, whether it's effect button users who regularly petition the DM for on the fly powers or non-effect button users who either fail to make use of the DM or the DM regularly shuts them down, are playing the game incorrectly.I think that's where the backlash against 4E comes. D&D players expect the fighter to be asking the DM if he can do a cool thing every now and then and the fact that he now has effect buttons makes him more like a wizard. When the fighter is relying on his effect buttons to do things rather than petitioning the DM players used to the old order feel that he is breaking those unwritten "rules".This is, of course, completely absurd. Games should not have unwritten rules much less expect players (particularly new ones) to abide by them. If this "shadow rule" that does not appear in any D&D book for any edition ever is the core of "The Uniquely D&D Experience" as some people call it then I want nothing to do with it.</blockquote>

Verification