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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Falling Icicle" data-source="post: 6225293" data-attributes="member: 17077">True, but there are a few things to keep in mind. First, people get proficiency bonuses to certain saving throws now. Their odds of resisting are much higher for those saves. Also, spells aren't nearly as deadly as they used to be. There is a notable lack of save-or-die spells in Next, and most debilitating effects let the defender save again on each round to break free of the effect. It's not like 3e and before where one failed save would often mean you lose.[Edit] To be honest, I would prefer that they just get rid of the proficiency bonus on saving throws and save DCs entirely. Then everyone would be on even footing, based on their respective ability scores, and there wouldn't be this whole arms race with escalating DCs vs save bonuses. Spellcasters have a wide enough variety of spells that they can target pretty much any save they want, so having proficiency in one or two out of the six abilities isn't very helpful. It just creates an increasingly widening gap between one's good and poor saves for casters to exploit. And I say this as someone who loves playing casters.I agree with you here. The tiny +5 (at most) modifier you can get from your abilities has a very small impact compared to the d20, making the game very swingy. Even with the attributes of an Olympic athlete, one can easily fail at routine tasks in this system. It's a problem I've been bringing up since the playtest's beginnings. The +6 (maximum) from skills helps, but not nearly enough. This is why they had to do the Band-Aid fix of giving rogues an additional +5, because nobody likes failing so very often at things that rogues should be good at. Unfortunately, that only helps rogues. Everyone else is out of luck. Hopefully, they'll take a serious look at the math now that the public playtest is over and fix it before the game is released. Why they didn't work this out from the very beginning, I don't know.They did adjust. They didn't just delete saving throws, the made them part of abilities. That's an adjustment.</blockquote>

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