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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DEFCON 1" data-source="post: 6125918" data-attributes="member: 7006">Actually... that's not completely correct.  At least, that's not the real focus of my point.My main point is not that any one "fluff" based character element should appear only once in the game... but rather that no character should need more than a couple of these elements in their character design.  Because the more "fluffy" elements you keep inserting into your characters, the more watered down the fluff becomes.We decide what our character is when we create it.  If we want him or her to be a pirate... we can just say "my character's a pirate!"  We've been doing it that way for decades.  But now, let's start layering in the fluff.  We choose race, he's now an Elf Pirate.  We choose sub-race, he's now a Wood Elf pirate.  We choose background, he's now a Wood Elf Commoner Pirate.  We choose class, he's now a Wood Elf Commoner Fighter Pirate.  Let's throw in a specialty.  He's now a Wood Elf Commoner Fighter Skirmisher Pirate.Should we keep going?  How about we throw in a Fighter's subclass?  He's now a Wood Elf Commoner Fighter Skirmisher Samurai Pirate.Wait, what?Yep.  Because the game for the Fighters are assigning fluff-based sub-classes... we've now seen a new layer added to this already massive bouillabaisse of character design, and that aspect runs completely counter to the concept you are creating.  Now, why did we choose Samurai?  Probably because whatever the mechanics were that the samurai had made sense for our character... even though the fluff of the sub-class had nothing to do with our character.  But we had to take samurai because we didn't have any non-fluffy choice.  We just want our Fighter to do X, Y, and Z.  But we have no need or desire for him to be a Samurai to accomplish it.And this is completely different than the Cleric and Wizard sub-classes.  The Cleric class says you gain your spells from a god.  Choose who that god is.  That's it.  It doesn't tell you you're a Missionary for your god.  It doesn't tell us you're a Templar for your god.  It doesn't tell us you're a Cloistered Priest for your god.  You can make that decision for yourself for whatever you want your character to be.  You choose what your character does... the game's sub-class tells you what you get for doing it.Likewise... the Wizard class says you use magic to cast spells.  These spells are grouped together in "schools" based on how they do what they do.  If you want to focus on just a certain group, then you can get a few extra abilities for doing so.  It doesn't tell you your character's a Witch Doctor.  It doesn't tell you your character's a Dragon Sorcerer.  It doesn't tell you your character's an Arcane Trickster.  You get to decide on any of those things yourself.  You choose who you are... and the sub-class gives you stuff for how you do it.What about the Fighter?  The Fighter class seems to me to be saying that you use a myriad of weapons and combat styles to fight enemies.  Doesn't it make sense that our sub-classes would therefore be weapon groups, or combat styles?  The Clerics says "Choose a god.  Your sub-class is the god you chose."  The Wizard says "Choose a school of spells.  Your sub-class is the school you chose."  The Fighter says "Choose a weapon and/or combat style.  Your sub-class is a fluffy job that might USE that weapon and/or combat style."How does that make any sense?  If I'm a Fighter and I want to focus on light armor, light weapons, and perhaps a bit of archery... why do I have to be assigned the JOB of "Scout"?  If I want to focus on two-handed blades with the potential of a second smaller blade... why does that automatically make me a Samurai?  Especially considering I had already chosen right off the top that I wanted to be a Pirate?Too much fluff and too many jobs being assigned to characters without our choice.  It waters OUR design down.</blockquote>

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