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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Stalker0" data-source="post: 4491413" data-attributes="member: 5889">What in particular do you feel was noncombat about 3rd edition that has been lost in 4th.For example, let's take the rogue. In 3e, he got sneak attack, uncanny dodge, and trap sense. All of those are combative abilities. His main noncombat powers were his large number of skills.In 4e, the rogue also has a large number of skills. He can gain more with feats, and skills tend to be more useful across the game. You also have magic items that can add to skills.As far as I'm concerned, the 3e rogue and 4e rogue are just as noncombative as each other. Heck in some ways the 4e rogue is less combative, simply because I have powers that work with my skills.Now I could see the point throw at the spellcasters. Spellcasters in general are definately forced into a more combatitive aspects. While rituals can help, most powers are definately geared towards combat.</blockquote>